altercation w/ dealer and floor at Bellagio

[snorer]

playing 4/8 at around 4am when a few friends of mine come and jump in the game. It's gotten quite good since they've joined, since they've been straddling, blind 3-betting preflop, etc. Needless to say the action's really been picking up. Then this situation comes up...

Friend 1 straddles, fairly tight but bad player utg+2 announces 3-bets, all fold to a woman on my right who "calls", I'm on the CO with KJo and muck, when the action gets to the blinds it's revealed that the initial 3 bettor was actually dealt out of the hand. At which point the discussion over it starts and I say "well that sucks, because if I had known he didn't 3 bet I would have played my hand". The dealer then proceeds to yell at me "he doesn't even have cards, how can he 3 bet!?", I respond "well what the [censored], how am I supposed to know that if you don't announce it when he says 3-bet"? Immediately he calls the floor on me for use of the "f-bomb". I'm shocked that he called the floor given that I've heard so much excessive swearing during the past few days playing there and never once had a floor been called. I ask "are you kidding? Seriously, are you kidding me?". He raises his voice again at me saying he's not and again calls for the floor. The floorman Todd comes over, at which point I sit quietly and let the dealer explain the action in the hand and the situation, waiting for my turn to speak. I'm well aware my cards are in the muck and I'm not looking to play my hand, but being that the dealer made an error and when I said something about it gave me an attitude and offered no consideration what so ever, I'm a little annoyed and don't mind letting the floor hear about it. So after he voices his complaint of me swearing, I say something along the lines "yea, I apologize for swearing, but if anyone has a legitimate complaint here it's me for you not keeping control of your table." The dealer and the floor look at me like I have 2-heads and before I can even finish trying to explain my gripe the floor cuts me off and asks me if I want to keep playing. "Yeah, I do, but..." "then be quiet" "be quiet? Why?" "because you're being a jerk". I was astonished that a floorman at Bellagio could be so unprofessional that not only would he refuse to hear my side of the story, but insult me in front of the table for voicing a completely reasonable complaint in a polite way (I really was completely polite, minus the swearing). At this point I can see the table is getting tired of the hoopla so I say ok, play 2 hands until my BB, and then excuse myself to go talk to the floor in private.

I sit down with him and explain the situation from my point of view, and my intention. I wasn't concerned about the hand, even though it essentially cost me a decent sized pot, but I recognize dealers make mistakes and it was a douche bag move for the player with no cards to 3 bet. I don't expect the dealer to be perfect, I mean hell, I pay good attention to my tables and it slipped by me too, but a) he's completely out of line to raise his voice to me when I mention I would have played the hand (not even directly to him, just in general) and b) it's a little bit over the top to call the floor for swearing in a situation where he could be a little more understanding. But I'm over that now, what's really bothering me is the floor's approach and remarks. I let him know how completely out of line and unprofessional it is to insult me when I try to speak to him after politely waiting my turn, how he neglected to do his job by listening to a player, etc, etc. He offers me nothing in return, just talks in circles and overall acts carefree about it. I then ask to speak to his boss and I sit down with Jim.

Out of the 3 staff members involved, Jim showed the only signs of any rationality or reason what so ever. I let him know by this point I wasn't upset, but being that Todd had acted so unprofessional and even after speaking to him privately offered no understanding at all and was so blase about it, I felt it necessary to let him know of my experience and how displeased I was. He tells me he understands, agrees with me, and says he will speak to Todd. "He isn't going to lose his job, but I will definitely talk to him about that". Obviously I didn't expect nor want him to lose his job, so overall I was just relieved someone there could understand where I was coming from. But Jim's demeanor seemed pretty unconcerned as well. I'm sure they deal with bigger issues there, but I was still pretty surprised the staff mistreatment of players wouldn't be a big deal, especially after I had mentioned I had played bigger games there and had tipped the staff very well (I was tipping each dealer when they left the table an average of $3, tipping cocktail waitresses excessively, always tipping the cashiers, chip runners, even floormen when they would seat me)

So my questions are...

do you think Todd and Michael (the dealer) were as out of line as I think they were?

and

for Bellagio players, what is your opinion on the staff reacting to situations like this? Any similar experiences or lack thereof?

I hope I didn't come off as a crybaby, but I sincerely was perplexed at Todd's reaction. I really couldn't care less about it now, but on the same hand I don't mind throwing it out there either

ty

[Jeffage]

A mistake was made. That being said, you didn't just curse. You cursed AT the dealer and then made a ridiculous scene when the floor asked you to be quiet. No one wants to listen to your whining. It's a low limit, friendly game...lighten up a bit. If you had just said, "I just think the dealer should pay more attention and make sure everyone knows it was only 2 bets, not 3," you would have gotten your point across effectively and without embarassing yourself.

Jeff

[dicelumpY2005]

I think your story just confirms what I've been hearing quite a bit lately: that the Bellagio staff is one of the unfriendliest in town. Believe it or not, I dealt to 2 tables in a row last night that were having that same conversation: that they don't like the Bellagio because of the staff. You don't come off as a crybaby, just another pissed off Bellagio player...

[gazarsgo]

Crybaby, no, but talking privately with the floor is a little weird. Mistakes happen; you should have let it go after the floor was a dick to you, and your argument about why using the f-bomb was "ok" is completely bogus.

[tpir90036]

no 4/8 game could possibly deserve this much writing.

[daryn]

i got into a little situation with the floor at borgata last weekend. he was way out of line and openly insulted me in front of everyone at the table, before i had even said anything insulting. he then did the same bit where he asked me "do you want to keep playing or not?" i should have said, nah i'm done, i think i'll head over to your mother's house and see what she's up to.

[Patrick del Poker Grande]

I would've picked up my chips right there on the spot and went to the Mirage.

[peterchi]

[ QUOTE ]
i got into a little situation with the floor at borgata last weekend. he was way out of line and openly insulted me in front of everyone at the table, before i had even said anything insulting. he then did the same bit where he asked me "do you want to keep playing or not?" i should have said, nah i'm done, i think i'll head over to your mother's house and see what she's up to.

[/ QUOTE ]

I already said it once here, but that was F'in sweet.

[The Armchair]

I honestly wonder if part of the problem is how little some dealers and floormen understand poker, certainly in comparison to things like blackjack.

In blackjack, skipping a player actually saves the player money.

But in poker, it doesn't work that way. A dealer error costs the player money and typically not the house. If you can expect to make 2 BB/hr (which should be difficult at 4/8 with tip/rake), one hand with $30 in it really may have cost you two hours of play. Crazy.

[daryn]

[ QUOTE ]
I honestly wonder if part of the problem is how little some dealers and floormen understand poker, certainly in comparison to things like blackjack.

In blackjack, skipping a player actually saves the player money.

But in poker, it doesn't work that way. A dealer error costs the player money and typically not the house. If you can expect to make 2 BB/hr (which should be difficult at 4/8 with tip/rake), one hand with $30 in it really may have cost you two hours of play. Crazy.

[/ QUOTE ]

well, not really. it could have saved him 2 hours of play too. in reality the hand he missed only cost him the expectation of his hand, in this case KJo on the button. it probably cost him some small fraction of a big bet.