A question about JT suited

[JimRivett]

This happened yesterday at the Bike in an 8/16 game, and while the game was full, there are only four players involved this hand.

Seat 1 is a very loose and somewhat agressive Asian, he plays far too many hands, however because of the amount of time we have spent playing against each other, I would like to think he respects my game.

The button is a white guy in his mid to late 30's, very loose but a little passive especially on later streets, I have played against him once before.

The small blind is an Asian in his 40's who while making some questionable preflop plays, has a solid postflop game.

I am the big blind.

I'm dealt J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 10 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] in the big blind, the action is folded to seat 1 who calls, folded to the button who calls, the small blind completes and I knuckle. Four of us are off to the flop.

The flop comes 4 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 10 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Small blind checks, I bet, and everbody calls.

The turn is the 9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Small blind checks, I bet and seat 1 raises. Both the button and the small blind call without hesitation.

What is your move?

[ike]

Call and checkcall any river. You're ahead a lot of the time and are drawing very live most of the time you're not but its gonna be really hard to tell which cards actually improve your hand. A ten probably doesn't and its anyone's guess whether or not you want to see a jack or a spade.

[kings]

I agree with the previous post. Your looking down possible two pair/striaght draw/or high flush draw. Best bet is to call the turn, then check/call river and see if flush hits.

[haakee]

I would just call the turn. Your spade draw might not be good when you hit it and your top pair mediocre kicker might not be the best hand. Additionally, a 3-bet won't increase your chances of winning this pot.

[andyfox]

You can't fold and 3-betting doesn't seem right since you may be behind and you may be drawing dead.

More interesting, what is your plan for the river? I think I'd bet a spade, a jack, or a 4. What do you think UTG's most likely hand is, T-9?

[JimRivett]

I appreciate the feedback.

Well at this point I was quite certain that I am behind to seat 1, I was sure he has 2 pair - 9 4, 9 5 or 9 10, although he would have probably raised my flop bet with a 10. I also didn't like both the button and the small blind cold calling two big bets, and they both called without hesitation. I'm certain that at least one of them is drawing to a flush. So it would appear that I only have 3 "clean" outs.

There is no doubt in my mind that I'm drawing thin and that I should lay this hand down, but I call.

The river is a spade and as soon as it hits the table the small blind bets out, I have another opportunity to get out of the hand but instead I make a crying call. The other two players fold, and the small blind shows me A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. Seat 1 grumbles something about 2 pair, I don't know what the button had.

I was disappointed with my play of this hand because I should have trusted my reads and folded to the raise on the turn.

Jim

[Nottom]

[ QUOTE ]
I was disappointed with my play of this hand because I should have trusted my reads and folded to the raise on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

If the SB instead flipped up his 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]6 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] would you still be posting this hand?

[andyfox]

11:1 to call, closing the action. With top pair and a flush draw. Since the blinds were involved, even if they were on a flush draw there's a greater likelihood of their flush cards being smaller than yours than if they were non-blinds.

I suspected an unhappy ending to the story, but I still don't see how you can lay it down on the turn.

Andy

[ike]

Why the christ do you bet a 4?

[ike]

Getting stuck in a pot drawing slim sucks but theres quite frankly no reason to think you're in that much trouble here. if your flush draw is live only half the time and you're never ahead on the turn you still have a clear call.