Calling down is good?

[onegymrat]

9/18 live with the usual suspects. Two hands that I felt I gained more BBs from calling down. Thoughts?

HAND 1: Very LAG just sat down from a table change because his dealer was "unlucky". He proceeded to raise most of his hands. He is UTG and raises. Folded to me in MP and I 3-bet with A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. All fold to LAG who calls.

Flop: A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

LAG bets. I call.

Turn: 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

LAG bets. I call.

River: 3 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

LAG bets. I call.

HAND 2: UTG (quiet but unknown to me) limps. Folded to me on the button, I raise with A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. SB folds, BB calls as does UTG. Three to the flop.

Flop: K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Checked to me, I bet. BB folds, UTG check-raises. At this point, I actually forgot if I had a club or not. I call.

Turn: 4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I did a quick unnoticable peek at my club. UTG bets, I call.

River: 5 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

UTG bets, I call.

[nepenthe]

I raise the river in both situations at the very least and call a fairly unlikely 3-bet.

[Nightwish]

I would raise the turn in both hands. I know you're trying to sucker them in so that they will bet the river (in fact, you may want to raise the river, especially in hand 2), but they may very well call your turn raise and call your river bet too.

[Steve Giufre]

Raise turn both hands.

[SGS]

Hand one I like the call down as you are probably getting him to spew chips on a bluff he woulda given up on had you raised.

Hand two I think you should throw in a raise somewhere, either turn or flop, as you probably have the best hand and if he is on a club draw he isn't goin anywhere anyways.

SGS

[onegymrat]

Well, I think it's unanimous, including myself! A raise somewhere in hands would have been a better play. Just wanted to hear the obvious.

However, in Hand 1, the LAG was either betting with nothing, or flopped something big. By the river, I feel the call is clearly correct with that straight board. Also, I felt that if he had nothing all along, he would fold to a turn raise and I would not gain one extra BB on the river.

In Hand 2, once realizing I had the club [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img], I should have raised. Got to pay more attention next time. Although I put him on KQ with the Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] or perhaps K9s. I didn't feel he had a made flush going and felt calling down was best to keep him betting.

As I hinted in my post, calling was truly better with THESE particular situations (not usually), for they would have both folded to turn raises.

HAND 1: Right when I called the river bet, LAG mucked and said, "Take it!". I didn't have to show.

HAND 2: UTG showed first with Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. He got really mad for some reason, threw the cards at the dealer and racked up and left the table.

Sometimes, it works out okay. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[ike]

I raise the flop in the first expecting to be 3bet by a worse hand. Should this happen I raise again on the turn and call down a 3bet. I raise the turn in the second.

[Lawrence Ng]

Nothing wrong with your plays here.

On hand one, against a LAG who likes to bet all the way, calling isn't so bad sometimes because a raise will scare him off if he drawing dead. I do it all the time with monster hands.

On hand two, I would have put UTG on a set so your call mode isn't so bad either. A raise on the flop isn't a bad idea, but it's ok if you don't do it.

[SoBeDude]

I really think you find a raise in both of these cases.

Lets face it. Premium hands don't come around often enough, so when you get one, you have to maximise their value. calling down does NOT maximize your return.

In the second hand, you MUST raise the turn. You're going to be ahead so frequently here that the raise is for value. Missing just a few value bets/raises a session can have a huge negative impact on your win-rate.

In the first hand, I'm torn about where to raise. If he's as LAGGY as you indicated, it depends on how far he goes once he shows strength. Even most LAGs will back down with nothing if played back at, so that tends to make me lean towards a river raise, but the coordinated board makes it harder to raise. And also on the turn, he'll call your raise with as little as an '8' in his hand, leaving him a gutshot.

But in any case, find a raise.

-Scott

[SA125]

Hand 1 - If you're going to 3 bet him with AQ, you couldn't ask for a much better board. He raised UTG so I wouldn't be worried about that straight. I think you're wrong there.

Hand 2 - AA and no raise after the flop. Lost bet there.