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  #1  
Old 06-24-2005, 03:27 AM
MegumiAmano MegumiAmano is offline
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Default Preflop 66

I'm just learning, but I'm really enjoying the process. This hand confused me, but I suspect that it's probably not that hard.

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Ultimate Bet 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. CO posts a blind of $0.25.
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, BB calls, <font color="#CC3333">UTG caps</font>, Hero ???
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  #2  
Old 06-24-2005, 03:29 AM
milesdyson milesdyson is offline
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Default Re: Preflop 66

you should think more about this.

compare your first call of 2 bets to your second call of 2 bets. the first call could get you to the flop three handed to the flop, and you would have gotten about 2:1 on your call. the second call you are now closing the action getting 6:1.

which one should you concern yourself with? the first one. so fold the first time. the second call is necessary.

edit: there are times where the first coldcall is okay, as in you know there are 2-3 looooose players behind you who you fully expect to come along with you. most often you should fold.
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  #3  
Old 06-24-2005, 12:27 PM
MegumiAmano MegumiAmano is offline
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Default Re: Preflop 66

Thanks for the reply. My thought process (or lack thereof) was like this.

Lee Jones says to fold the first one. SSH says to call it, if the table is loose. The table was pretty loose (preflop anyway). Lots of players would see most flops, and then they seemed to fold easily. So, I made that cold call.

I've been following the advice in SSH that says I should focus more of my study as a newbie on post-flop play. So I just memorized their starting charts and read the text a few times, but haven't really studied the math behind it yet.

The second time, I was thinking that it wouldn't have been raised twice again unless I was up against some really good hands. As you point out, I completely ignored the size of the pot and focused on the fact that my 66 was starting to look pretty weak and that pairs don't like lots of opponents.*

When you say that it's 6-1 and I'm closing action, which is better than 2-1 when it's uncertain, I understand what you mean. I clearly didn't see that at the time, but it makes sense now. However, I don't understand how to calculate that 6-1 is high enough odds with a 66. Am I focusing on the 12% chance that I'll flop another 6? This is 7-1 I think. ( (100-12)/12 : 1) If that's correct, then is it the implied odds plus other long-shot outs that make my 6-1 pot odds worth calling?


(* This is what was going through my head at the time. I'm not saying that it's correct.)
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  #4  
Old 06-24-2005, 12:31 PM
Quercus Quercus is offline
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Default Re: Preflop 66

[ QUOTE ]

If that's correct, then is it the implied odds plus other long-shot outs that make my 6-1 pot odds worth calling?


[/ QUOTE ]

Correct.
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  #5  
Old 06-24-2005, 12:34 PM
gopnik gopnik is offline
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Default Re: Preflop 66

Hero calls.
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  #6  
Old 06-24-2005, 12:38 PM
davelin davelin is offline
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Default Re: Preflop 66

I'd fold the first cold-call and call the second.
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  #7  
Old 06-24-2005, 12:47 PM
imported_The Vibesman imported_The Vibesman is offline
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Default Re: Preflop 66

You should probably think about folding this in EP against an early raiser, as if no one calls you won't get good odds to play for set value. Once you have called the first bet I think you really need to call the cap, and at that point are probably getting good odds on your hand. Be prepared to release on the flop if you don't hit, unless the board is ragged.
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  #8  
Old 06-24-2005, 12:58 PM
droolie droolie is offline
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Default Re: Preflop 66

[ QUOTE ]

Lee Jones says to fold the first one. SSH says to call it, if the table is loose.

[/ QUOTE ] What? Where does SSH say to cold call a UTG raise with 66? Fold this like 95% of the time unless you KNOW you will have a 5 way pot or more.

*I see it's on the loose chart. Use the tight one instead.
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  #9  
Old 06-24-2005, 01:07 PM
MegumiAmano MegumiAmano is offline
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Default Re: Preflop 66

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Lee Jones says to fold the first one. SSH says to call it, if the table is loose.

[/ QUOTE ] What? Where does SSH say to cold call a UTG raise with 66? Fold this like 95% of the time unless you KNOW you will have a 5 way pot or more.

*I see it's on the loose chart. Use the tight one instead.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're correct. The table was loose though, so that's why I was using that chart. They do mention in the section on small pairs that you should only cold call these when you're almost certain that it will be a 5-handed pot. At the time, I had completely forgotten about that.
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  #10  
Old 06-24-2005, 01:11 PM
AmarilloJim1 AmarilloJim1 is offline
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Default Re: Preflop 66

IMO, this is only a limp in hand in EP, if and only if, the table is loose and passive. You want to see the flop cheaply with a lot of callers.

I wouldn't cold call two bets here unless the table was very loose.
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