15/30 ramming & jamming with JJ

Nightwish · #1 08-07-2004, 04:07 PM

Here's a hand I played last night. Typical loose aggressive game with only one solid opponent (and he's the villain in this hand!) I think the action is debatable on all streets but the river.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Nightwish is UTG with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
Nightwish raises, UTG+1 (VeryLAG) calls, 2 folds, MP2 (TAG) 3-bets, 1 fold, CO (LoosePassive) calls, 2 folds, BB (LAG) calls, Nightwish caps, UTG+1 (VeryLAG) calls, MP2 (TAG) calls, CO (LoosePassive) calls, BB (LAG) calls.

Flop: (20.66 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
LAG checks, Nightwish bets, VeryLAG calls, TAG raises, LoosePassive folds, LAG folds, Nightwish calls, VeryLAG calls.

Turn: (13.33 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Nightwish bets, VeryLAG calls, TAG raises, Nightwish 3-bets, VeryLAG folds, TAG calls.

River: (20.33 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Nightwish bets, TAG calls.

Final Pot: 22.33 BB
Main Pot: 22.33 BB, between Nightwish and TAG.

bicyclekick · #2 08-07-2004, 05:25 PM

Why cap pf?

flop - blegh. I'm not going to complain too much, but that's not exactly a sexy flop. YOu gotta call the raise. I would c/f the turn less that jack came, though. if it was HU and or you didn't cap pf I woulnd't be so scared, but given the action I don't feel very good about it.

Turn - my guess is the TAG has AK with the k of clubs.

river - fine.

Garland · #3 08-07-2004, 08:06 PM

Preflop: I'm not a big fan of the preflop cap. Usually with the average opponent, I'll cap with AA, KK, QQ or AK...all given the right conditions. Capping with JJ out of position just doesn't feel right here.

Flop: I don't like the bet on the flop simply because you're up against 5 opponents, and you're most certainly going against an A, and it's unlikely you're going to pry it from their hands with the pot this size. Unnecessary aggression, and I don't think it accomplishes what you want it to. You're just making it more expensive for yourself to see the turn.

In this instance, I think you should just be willing to call a single bet on the flop and see what develops on the turn.

Turn: That's a fine bet because you don't want this thing to somehow check through. In fact you want the chance to 3-bet, and it's much more profitable than check-raising trapping VeryLAG for an extra bet in the process. It's doubtful you're against a flush, but I'm sure you'll find out if there is one.

River: River plays itself. I'm pretty sure he has AK, and if my senses are working right, he should have the K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

Garland

bicyclekick · #4 08-07-2004, 09:46 PM

I thought about this hand while at supper and concluded that AA was equally likely.

Nightwish · #5 08-09-2004, 04:28 AM

I capped preflop because there was still a decent chance that I had the best hand and I wanted to get the fish to put in the money while they were behind.

The flop was about as bad as they come. I bet because I wanted to get information, particularly from the TAG. If he raised, I knew for a fact that he had an A. In fact, I can't imagine him not raising with an A, and I can't imagine him raising with anything less than an A. So when he raised, my plan was to call it and check-fold the turn unless I improved. Of course, once I spiked the J, it was pretty straightforward.

And yes, he had the A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. Kudos to bicyclekick and Garland for correctly identifying it. Remind me never to play with either of you.

TwoNiner · #6 08-09-2004, 01:18 PM

What else have you seen the TAG 3 bet preflop that makes you think your jacks have a decent chance to be ahead preflop? From the flop on, I just don't see anyway you can be calling big bets much less raising.

Nightwish · #7 08-09-2004, 03:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
What else have you seen the TAG 3 bet preflop that makes you think your jacks have a decent chance to be ahead preflop?

[/ QUOTE ]
He'll definitely 3-bet me with any AK, AQs, and pairs of TT and up. He may also 3-bet with AJs, 99, and AQo.

[ QUOTE ]

From the flop on, I just don't see anyway you can be calling big bets much less raising.

[/ QUOTE ]
The flop call is easy, and it's not even close. The only question is whether I should have check-called or bet out and called if someone were to raise. You can go either way here. I chose the latter to obtain some information.

I would say that the turn action is also obvious.

TwoNiner · #8 08-09-2004, 04:33 PM

Noticing that you hit your set on the turn changes things ever so slightly. [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img] I'm crap in the morning w/out my diet coke.

Garland · #9 08-09-2004, 05:22 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The flop was about as bad as they come. I bet because I wanted to get information, particularly from the TAG.

[/ QUOTE ]

This would be more reasonable with 1 or 2 opponents and a much smaller pot.

Garland

astroglide · #10 08-09-2004, 05:38 PM

the only information you're going to get is that your bet has been raised. what did you do with that information that you wouldn't have done if you checked?

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