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  #11  
Old 10-10-2005, 03:48 PM
Notorious G.O.B. Notorious G.O.B. is offline
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Default Re: Tell?

Out of curiousity, do good chinese poker or gin rummy players organize their hands, or leave them as they're drawn?
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  #12  
Old 10-10-2005, 03:49 PM
mcguw mcguw is offline
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Default Re: Tell?

I'm mildly dyslexic, so you can do it easier than I can. On the other hand, I can count outs insanely quickly and accurately.
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  #13  
Old 10-10-2005, 04:39 PM
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Default Re: Tell?

[ QUOTE ]
Exactly. You should play Omaha just like you play Holdem in respect to looking at your cards. Peak at the corner while covering them, memorize them, protect them. How hard is it to remember 4 cards, dude?

[/ QUOTE ]

To come to the OP's defense, I have been playing Omaha live for longer than I care to remember, and I still have trouble remembering my cards sometimes. 4 cards is a lot different than 2 cards, particularly in a high low game. I look at my cards when they are dealt to me, and then look again after the flop, when just about everyone else at the table are looking at theirs, for every hand (not looking when I have a "memorable", i.e., good, hand could easily be a tell). But my feeling is that if I conceal them appropriately, I could look at them the whole time without anyone being able to see them.
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  #14  
Old 10-10-2005, 04:56 PM
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Default Re: Tell?

Instead of trying to memorize what you have you should be thinking about what you NEED.

Example you hold A2KQ, with the Ace suited in hearts. You look at your cards and don't need to look at them again becasue you are thinking I need low cards, Hearts or Broadway cards.

Another example:
You hold 569J, you look at your cards and should be thinking, How the hell did I get in this hand?

Be thinking about what you need, not simply what you have. If you need to look back to check or be sure I don't think it's hurting you.
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  #15  
Old 10-10-2005, 06:47 PM
FeliciaLee FeliciaLee is offline
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Default Re: Tell?

In Chinese I've seen everyone arrange their hands. I think that it can almost be played by rote. Maybe 999 times out of 1000 hands it wouldn't make a difference. There are times when knowing how an opponent sets his hand will make a difference, but that is more of a general knowledge of opposition, rather than watching him set his hand.

In Gin, I think the difference between "good" and "great" has much more disparity than in Poker or Chinese. While I haven't seen "great" players playing Gin, I have heard stories. Stories of almost instant card memorization and not looking back until one is knocking or declaring Gin. Scary.

I highly take advantage of the looky-loo's playing live O8. I don't think they have any idea how much they are giving away.

I also do the reverse tell sometimes if I'm in wise company and know I'm being watched. It only works the first time, but sometimes that is all it takes, especially in a final table tourney situation.

Felicia [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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  #16  
Old 10-10-2005, 06:59 PM
FeliciaLee FeliciaLee is offline
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Default Re: Tell?

Having dyslexia might make this much harder. I completely understand your difficulty, because while I was doing chemo, I noticed sometimes the L's in words were backwards. At first I thought someone had made a mistake on the site I was reading, but then I noticed it again and again. It especially occurred in words where the L was in the middle, and the word could almost be completely flipped and remain the same. I thought I'd lost my mind. But thankfully it went away.

Anyway, the way I learned to memorize cards was from the top rank down in high games, bottom rank up in split or low.

So in O8, this is how I do it. I peek at each card as I receive it (left corner only, very quickly). I say them in order of rank (ace always low), like this: A24J. I repeat them in my head until they are memorized.

If anything is suited, I say the suit after I say the ranks. So like my A24J hand. If the ace was suited, I'd say: A24J, ace spades. I don't bother with the suited side card unless it could make a straight flush (or blocks one).

If I'm double suited, I'll say: A24J, ace spades, jack hearts.

If I'm rainbow, I'll add nothing at the end. If I have three of one suit, I'll say: A24J, ace...three spades.

I have tried looking and memorizing after watching everyone else looks, as I would in HE, but found that I get little from them during the deal, while I get a much greater advantage having them memorized early, then watching my opponents during the actual play of the hand.

Chanting my hand in my head during the deal is easy and takes very little time. I hope this helps.

Felicia [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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  #17  
Old 10-10-2005, 09:43 PM
gergery gergery is offline
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Default Re: Tell?

[ QUOTE ]
Do you arrange them face up on the table? That would be a tell.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you look close, you can see my lips silently mouthing the suits and ranks of my cards.

-g
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  #18  
Old 10-11-2005, 12:30 AM
DPCondit DPCondit is offline
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Default Re: Tell?


But if you are looking at your cards when the flop hits, you can't see how other players are reacting to the flop, and you miss tells from others, whether you give one off yourself or not.
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  #19  
Old 10-11-2005, 08:36 AM
chaos chaos is offline
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Default Re: Tell?

Yes it is a problem.

You should not be picking your cards off the table. Players on either side of you may get a peak at your cards.

The fact that your cards are in numerical order will not give away much if you do it every hand. If you are going to rearrange your cards, you will need to do it even for hands you are going to fold preflop. Otherwise it is a big tell.

It would be better to just memorize your hand without rearranging the cards. Then do not look back at your cards during the hand. Someone who keeps checking their cards is letting everyone else at the table know that they are not a very experienced player and possibly what cards they hold.
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  #20  
Old 10-11-2005, 08:58 AM
Ironman Ironman is offline
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Default Memorizing Cards

Over in the Stud forum, in the FAQ section you will see a long list of suggestions about posting to that group.

As you can imagine, they have had more than a few people ask about memorizing all those cards.

In there you will find two links (I believe they are "Post 1" and "Post 2".)

They have listed 10 ways to improve your memory of the cards.

Take a look.

Dave
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