One from the archives...

[Lawrence Ng]

I've been digging up in the old archives in the mid section back from 2000 to 2003.

If there is enough interest, I am thinking of pulling some hands from there and opening them up for discussion again on here.

Here's a post Jim Brier made back in August 2000 and I was a bit surprised at Mason's response:

Jim wrote:

Posted by: Jim Brier 30/60
Posted on: Friday, 18 August 2000, at 12:54 p.m.

I am in Seat #3 as the big blind holding the 6h5h. #4 limps in under the gun and #7 raises to $60. #9 calls. I call for another $30. #4 calls. There is $260 in the pot and four players.

The flop is: Kh5s2c

I check my middle pair in this raised pot. #4 checks. #7, the pre-flop raiser, bets $30. #9 folds. I call for $30 with almost $300 in the pot with my 5 outer. #4 calls. There is $350 in the pot and three players.

The turn is: 6d

I check, planning to check-raise since #7 was the pre-flop raiser and bet the flop when it came King-high. But #4 checks. #7 checks. My plan failed.

The river is: Qs

I now bet $30 and only #7 calls. I win as he mucks.

Comments please.

Mason responded:


Posted by: Mason Malmuth (MasonMalmuth@TwoPlusTwo.com)
Posted on: Saturday, 19 August 2000, at 4:18 a.m.

Jim:

I haven't read the other comments, but here are mine.

Mason

"I am in Seat #3 as the big blind holding the 6h5h. #4 limps in under the gun and #7 raises to $60. #9 calls. I call for another $30."

I agree with this call.

"#4 calls. There is $260 in the pot and four players."

The flop is: Kh5s2c

"I check my middle pair in this raised pot. #4 checks. #7, the pre-flop raiser, bets $30. #9 folds. I call for $30 with almost $300 in the pot with my 5 outer. #4 calls. There is $350 in the pot and three players."

You have a problem here. Your hand may be best. With that being the case, you may have wanted to consider leading with a bet. However, I frequently would check to watch the action. Given that you did this, I would strongly consider check raising. This raise would be especially good against a player who migh call your check raise with something like a pair of jacks, but then fold on fourth street unless he improves (or picks up a draw).

"The turn is: 6d

"I check, planning to check-raise since #7 was the pre-flop raiser and bet the flop when it came King-high. But #4 checks. #7 checks. My plan failed."

There's a lot to consider here. I certainly would go for the check raise against someone who is prone to bet again without having a king (or better). However, you should strongly consider betting since there is a good chance the before the flop bettor does not have a king. (If he does have something like AK he may raise after you bet so the two bets go in anyway.

"The river is: Qs"

"I now bet $30 and only #7 calls. I win as he mucks."

If you check here, and the other player checks, you are both telling the original raiser that you don't have a king, and probably don't have a queen. If he holds a queen, he should be inclined to bet it, especially if he is aggressive. I'm not saying it's right, but you should have considered going for a checkraise.

Anyone here agree/disagree with Mason?

Lawrence

[mike l.]

the reason to bet the turn is so you can 3 bet against AK or AA or something.

anyway brier was dismissed long ago as being on crack and having no clue how to teach poker, and mason has proven to be in the same league with his worthless sporadic hands to talk about from the past couple years.

dig up something better.