Cap This River?

GTSamIAm · #1 10-02-2005, 01:17 PM

This guy just sat down. It folds to him and he just calls from the SB. I plan to do what I do with anyone who does that (barring reads): raise preflop, bet flop, folding to aggression.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is BB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
3 folds, SB completes, Hero raises, SB calls.

Flop: (4 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets, Hero raises, SB 3-bets, Hero calls.

Turn: (5 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

River: (7 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets, Hero raises, SB 3-bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 13 BB

#2 10-02-2005, 01:25 PM

grunch

I check preflop and call flop. Then I play it the same ie I dont cap the river.

GTSamIAm · #3 10-02-2005, 01:35 PM

Why do you just call on the flop? Do you mean you would have called in my position, or you would have called after you checked preflop and he bet the flop?

Is the preflop horrible against an unknown? What are my effective odds? Are they 5:2 or 2:2?

Fantam · #4 10-02-2005, 01:37 PM

I have just completed a couple of the MLL matches, and I am no expert in HU play, so I will just say what I think.

Your plan of auto raising SB preflop when he checks and following up with an auto bet or raise on the flop sounds reasonable enough. However, I would prefer to also consider the strength of my hand before automatically making any play.

Given the way that you played your hand, I would have liked a turn raise when you made top pair. If you were behind to 2 pair, a set or a made straight, you would probably have been reraised by SB.

The way SB played his hand, it suggests that he made a set on the flop, which improved to a boat on the river.

Fantam · #5 10-02-2005, 01:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Is the preflop horrible against an unknown? What are my effective odds? Are they 5:2 or 2:2?

[/ QUOTE ]

Your effective odds will depend upon how many bets SB makes.

Preflop, if SB just calls your raise, you will be getting 3:1 to see the flop.

GTSamIAm · #6 10-02-2005, 01:52 PM

That's exactly what I thought his hand was, but I figured it was possible he had two pair or a straight.

What are the merits of calling the turn and river versus raising the turn folding to a 3-bet? What hands does the villain bet the turn with?

GTSamIAm · #7 10-02-2005, 01:55 PM

I mean odds for the play, assuming SB never bets and I scoop the pot without incident. I'm making 2 small bets from him, but the pot will be 5 small bets when I win. I'm spending 2 small bets. So I don't understand if my odds are 2:2 or 5:2.

Fantam · #8 10-02-2005, 02:02 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I mean odds for the play, assuming SB never bets and I scoop the pot without incident. I'm making 2 small bets from him, but the pot will be 5 small bets when I win. I'm spending 2 small bets. So I don't understand if my odds are 2:2 or 5:2.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok. Your odds would be 3:2 if your play was successful.

You would win 3 sb (2 from SB + your original blind), and your play would risk 2 sb.

Fantam · #9 10-02-2005, 02:16 PM

[ QUOTE ]
That's exactly what I thought his hand was, but I figured it was possible he had two pair or a straight.

What are the merits of calling the turn and river versus raising the turn folding to a 3-bet? What hands does the villain bet the turn with?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think I can see what you are thinking. You seem to be assuming that SB would only 3-bet the flop with either 2 pair or a set. I thought that SB might also 3-bet the flop with top pair or an overpair smaller than 88.

Your range (of SB's possible hands) is probably more likely than mine, so that would suggest calling the turn bet to see if you improve by the river with your set or straight possibilities.

However, I think that with either range, calling SB's river bet seems to be more prudent than raising. Thats because when SB bets the river, he does not seem to be afraid of the possibility that you made trip 8's.

irishpint · #10 10-02-2005, 02:54 PM

we cant fold to a turn 3bet since we have the OESD

dont raise pf, it's not worth investing $ in a hand like this and getting married to the pot.
flop is fine, i MAY even cap it, if i think it'll get me that coveted free card. since i cannot fold to a 3bet i am not raising the turn. im raising the river but not capping.