When to start pushing with A-x etc?

[GoldenHorde]

This question is relating to the $10 - $30 SnG range.

So it seems like every tourney I play now where I hardly play any hands pre lvl 4 (Party) I find myself looking at A-4, A-8, K-J, 3's etc in MP with about 500-600 chips at a 5-8 person table. I am always 4-tabling so anything more then a general feel read usually isn't available.

Just wondering what line others take with these hands or what you need to start pushing.

[Maulik]

Its an adjustment, if people are playing passively or lots of limpers, I'll push in that kind of spot, shortstakced.

[New York Jet]

In good position, push with less than 10 times the BB. In other words, fold under the gun, but move all-in in late position with these hands. You want your all-in raises to face 3 or 4 hands, not 7.

Let's talk about the math behind this. You are UTG with 7 players left to act behind you. All of these players will call with the top 10% of hands. What are the odds your all-in move will be called? The answer is about 52%.

Now you make the same move in the cutoff position with 3 players left to act. What are the odds your all-in move will be called? The answer is about 27%.

Now in both situations, your odds when called are the same, meaning if you are called by AQo, it doesn't matter if you pushed UTG or CO, you are still only a 28% favorite to win. However, your folding equity has doubled. See the math for AQo versus your A5o in both situations below.

UTG raise = (48% Everyone folds x Blinds)+(15% Win all-in)-(37% You lose the pot)
CO raise = (73% Everyone folds x Blinds)+(8% Win all-in)-(19% You lose the pot)

When UTG, you will be out of the tourney 37% of the time, while in the CO, you will be out of the tourney 19% of the time. Again, bad position makes you twice as vulnerable.

So what I am trying to tell you is, raise in the correct situation. Your cards have little effect compared to position. It took me a nearly two years to figure this out (OK, I am a moron). I would rather raise with 52o in the CO than raise with A5o UTG.

One final comment: I've had a very rough day today, so excuse me if my math is off a little and I did not double check it like I usually do. I think you have a very legitimate question, but no one else was answering it. I hope this helps your game.

[Al P]

Wow that's nice.

[dfscott]

[ QUOTE ]
Your cards have little effect compared to position. It took me a nearly two years to figure this out (OK, I am a moron). I would rather raise with 52o in the CO than raise with A5o UTG.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the most important thing I've learned from eastbay's SnG Tool.

[GoldenHorde]

Thanks for the great reply, I thought this was a pretty legitimate question to get no responses. You pretty much confirmed my thoughts on it but i've been going through a very nasty streak and wanted some confirmation I was playing it right. I think I saw it come up 4-5 times today I was stuck with ~500 chips in LMP or CO on lvl 4 got dealt a weak Ace pushed and was busted needed to double check.

[New York Jet]

I too was enlightened by eastbay's SnG tools. I will probably be naming my next born after him. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]