11s-33s: Mid pocket pairs-Odds for Set Value/Mid level

rbear · #1 12-06-2005, 08:17 PM

How do you tend to play mid pairs on level 3? Say you flop a set or better 1/8 times. My average stack size here is around 650. So, I leak 350 chips before I hit a hand here. I need to double every other time to make this profitable. With the chance of being raised, wouldn't you need to almost double every time you hit a set or better to make it profitable to play these? What kind of pot odds do you need (if any) to limp these? Anyone straight fold these on this level (EP or LP) General thoughts?

EDIT:
Small pairs also. Basically 22-TT

bluef0x · #2 12-06-2005, 08:32 PM

Mid pocket pairs? Depends on my stack size and position/opponents... but most likely I fold anything under TT. These are really situation dependent but you should obviously fold in EP-MP most of the time with 'em.

tigerite · #3 12-06-2005, 08:51 PM

I think you can profitably play 77 and 88 from EP and MP because the times you do flop a set, and even sometimes overs against the right opponents, you will stack them more times than not. It's debateable you can go lower still at 11s and even to an extent at 22s, because whenever you flop a set, they'll be stacked.

At the 55s/109s, you can still stack people who get top pair, but it's rarer; that's why even with t200 more chips, it's certainly up for debate that lower than 77, and maybe even 77 itself, might be a fold from EP.

rbear · #4 12-07-2005, 04:03 AM

Has anyone done the math on this? It doesn't necessarily seem like an easy task, and it intuitively seems pretty close to me. I definitely don't double up every time I hit a set(or even every other). Maybe I'm just a total donk. Additionally, to get any sort of overpair value like you suggest, I find that more limpers in the pot is more likely for one to hit small top pair, and therefore, more likely to pay me off. With more limpers, also comes the chance that someone hits 2 pair, straight, flush draw, etc. I think that it potentially could be very close, or possible -EV, limping these in level 3 (just because of blinds relative to my average stack size at this level). Thoughts?