I Suck: Two Hands AK and JJ 5/10

fimbulwinter · #1 08-06-2005, 03:01 AM

First off a question that I think echoes bruiser's sentiments in a past post:

I feel like I play bad. Today was just like the other days, but when i look back at hands, I still feel I misplay a lot. Maybe it's because i'll play so long and see so many hands but i don't think that's it. The more I look, it's hard to believe other players are playing so much worse, but they are otherwise I wouldn't be winning.

I guess I'm becoming much more harshly introspective due to the new amounts of money for which i'm playing. Those little missed bets etc. are now $200 mistakes.

To the experienced players/posters:

Does there come a point where you play a session and say "wow, i played perfectly there"? I sure haven't had one of those, even on the days where i book huge wins.

Hand 1

Villain is flat out terrible. I can't describe how bad this guy is. Erattic, call any raise with any two, call to the river with a pair. stuck about 13 buyins thus far, the table waitlist is 3 times as long as i've ever seen it.

I (cover) open on CO with AK[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], villain (1000) calls on button, blinds fold

678 all [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (80)

I bet 80, he calls

9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (240)

check, check

K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (240)

check, I bet 100, he c/r to 200

Hand 2

Villain is very very good. mentioned in previous post, he plays what seems to be 12 hour days. he's almost always up and varies from tight to very loose as the button nears. his opener could be anything playable.

Villain (3K) opens for 35 in MP, two callers, I (cover) raise to 200 with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (this is rarely a steal) in SB, villain calls, limps out.

6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (480)

check, check

T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (300)

I bet 300, he calls

T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (900)

I check, he bets 900

fim

AZK · #2 08-06-2005, 03:21 AM

Hand 1: Why are you betting this river given this opponent description. Just check.

Hand 2: I feel like a river blocking bet would be nice, but otherwise I fold. Didn't feel like betting this river?

I hear what you are saying about the mistaks, I think a lot about that too, the missed river bets, the paid off river bets, the river seems to hound me more than the flop/turn. I feel that while I still have a lot to learn about the flop/turn, I have even more to learn about the river. What was that saying from the limit forum, something like "if TA could play every river for me, I would earn one extra bet an hour for life" or something like that. That's how I feel about my river play in NL.

There are times where I look back at a hand and think, I played that perfectly. These happen every few sessions. In other words, 1000s of hands and only one that was played "perfectly". I think so many things have to be aligned perfectly (for lack of a better word) to execute a hand perfectly. It's a whole combination of things which makes sense why it only happens rarely for me. As for sessions, I think it will be decades (if ever) where I can say I played every hand flawlessy from start to finish. I don't think it's possible. It requires too much. I don't know, just my thoughts.

rwperu34 · #3 08-06-2005, 03:47 AM

I kick myself at least 10 times a session thinking I should have done something other than what I did. Two things to keep in mind. First, most of these mistakes are small from an EV perspective, and although we want to try and play mistake free, even the very best don't do that all the time. Second, if your multitabling, this is the cause of many of your mistakes. You more than make up for those little mistakes (from a $ per hour standpoint) by seeing all those extra hands and taking advantage of all those extra big mistakes your opponents make.

I try and play perfect when I play live (rare, that I play live or perfect).

Hand #1: Check behind the river. The only problem I see with this is you were in the CO and he was on the button.

Hand #2: Make your continuation bet on the flop and end it there. If he calls, you are thru with the hand. Or check the flop, check the turn, block the river. Or, with stacks that deep in a position I don't steal from often, I might flat call preflop. Then, same lines as above except a much smaller pot.

captZEEbo1 · #4 08-06-2005, 04:36 AM

yeah river bet is very bad in hand 1.

hand 2 is very tough. He can be betting here with KK, AhKh (less likely), or the T.

The reason hands aren't played perfectly very often is because you can ONLY play a hand perfectly if you know:
A) all your opponent's tendencies
B) your opponents exact hole cards

Since you can't know a and b for sure, you can only play a hand perfect very rarely; ie. when you [luckily] put an opponent on a hand correctly, and bet accordingly. It's very hard to do. Everytime you make a mistake, you feel like an idiot, but in actuality, if your opponent happened to have the range of hands you put him on, your play would have been good.

technologic · #5 08-06-2005, 04:43 AM

play perfect poker
play perfect poker
play perfect poker

keep repeating this to yourself as you play

thabadguy · #6 08-06-2005, 04:57 AM

[ QUOTE ]
play perfect poker
play perfect poker
play perfect poker

keep repeating this to yourself as you play

[/ QUOTE ]
LOL. Thats about as helpful as saying
[censored] Jessica Alba
[censored] Jessica Alba
[censored] Jessica Alba

in getting to actually [censored] her.

savman · #7 08-06-2005, 05:00 AM

no matter how much of a donk this guy is, why are you value betting a pair on a four flush four str8 board? he has a pulse, he sees the draws on the flop. since he is a donk he is probably drawing to one of them. check behind.

hand 2. if i am playing against a very very good player, i am not looking to play a big pot oop with jj [or any pair]; especially when his range is "any reasonable hand", especially with 300 BB stacks. especially when i have defined my holding pf. by reraising oop you enter post flop play with an immediate disadvantage against an opponent who is capable of exploiting it. you are setting yourself up to make very costly decisions on subsequent streets. there is no shame in going to a flop and playing this hand for set value or playing it aggro on an undercard flop.

fimbulwinter · #8 08-06-2005, 05:07 AM

hand 2 question:

anyone else get massive alarm bells going off after the preflop action?

fim

fimbulwinter · #9 08-06-2005, 07:30 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
play perfect poker
play perfect poker
play perfect poker

keep repeating this to yourself as you play

[/ QUOTE ]
LOL. Thats about as helpful as saying
[censored] Jessica Alba
[censored] Jessica Alba
[censored] Jessica Alba

in getting to actually [censored] her.

[/ QUOTE ]

Though i know the chance of this working is slim to none, the reward is great enough to make the time investment worthwile.

now, back to chanting for me.

fim

Rotating Rabbit · #10 08-06-2005, 07:53 AM

fim, why are you betting the flop in hand 1? from what you describe of this villian he's not folding any possible holding on that flop, u just get a bigger pot on scary board with A high oop with no clue as to his holding, check fold for me there, could well be folding the best hand, but less -ev than playing on i think. and in hand 2 i vote for fold river, i mean ifyou were given this hand history and we did a poll 'who thinks hero in this hand called river?' i bet more than 50% would say hero called; dont think this villian can expect you to fold more than half of the time, so he has something that wins.