Flopping an over pair 99 - Who is right..... me or my brother??

XxGeneralxX · #1 03-09-2005, 01:26 PM

Me and my brother have been arguing about poker since we started. I play a smarter, tighter game and he acts like a loose cannon always trying to get all his money in the middle and cries and wines about his "bad beats"

I was playing in a .5/$1 (6) max room sitting with the max of $100. I get 99 in the big blind. There is an UTG limper and the guy in second position also limps. small blind calls and I raise 4x to $4. The UTG limper re-raises to $12 and the limper from second position CALLS. Now its on me and my pocket 99 has shrunk. I call.

Flop 8c 6d 2d

I check........... UTG bets $35
guy in second position folds
now its on me, im sitting with my over pair. what would you do???

"My brother says to put him all... your an idiot, u have an overpair." "He has AK or AQ i garuntee it."

hmmmmmmmmm..... ive invested $12 into this pot and the guy was sitting with more that $100 so it was certainly going to cost me ALOT more that $35 to see his hand.

Lemme see your responces and ill tell you what i did.

THANX

Greg J · #2 03-09-2005, 01:32 PM

You should post this in the SS NL forum. Not trying to be a jerk or anything -- since you are a new poster you likely don't know that. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

B Mando · #3 03-09-2005, 01:32 PM

You had two outs...good fold

jkkkk · #4 03-09-2005, 01:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
You had two outs...good fold

[/ QUOTE ]

my thoughts exactly.

jedi · #5 03-09-2005, 01:40 PM

[ QUOTE ]

"My brother says to put him all... your an idiot, u have an overpair." "He has AK or AQ i garuntee it."

[/ QUOTE ]

If he guaranteed it, you should have asked him to make the all-in bet and given him the resulting reward if he was right.

Limp-reraise from UTG smells like a monster. QQ at the worst.

axioma · #6 03-09-2005, 02:02 PM

whats your brother's screen name?

bookie socks · #7 03-09-2005, 02:09 PM

So would you have won if you stayed in? Did you get to see the other hole cards?

GrandmaStabone · #8 03-09-2005, 02:34 PM

[ QUOTE ]
So would you have won if you stayed in? Did you get to see the other hole cards?

[/ QUOTE ]

If he posted the results of the hand with its details it would bias any resulting discussion, ergo the results are posted after some theorizing has commenced.

Back to the hand, the limpreraise indicates 3 likely things:
1.) The obvious monster, AA KK or QQ. In which case good fold
2.) The not-so-obvious vulnerable hand. A lot of players, unsure about how to play a hand like jj or 1010 when overcards fall, will try to limp in with them in early position and when faced with a raise will make a HUGE protection bet because they don't want to fold them, but they want even less to play them out of position on a kq7 board.
3.) Your brother's suggestion. MANY people, ESPECIALLY at .5/1 see the AK as the mother of all hands, carrying it WAY too far when it is obvious it is drawing to 3-6 outs.

So what is the right move here? Well, of the three possibilities I labeled as likely, you can only beat one. The monster has you killed and the "fish protection" hands have you beat (1010, JJ). Even in the third scenario, in which the opponent would have to be the type to play AK this way, the limpreraise is unlikely, as any player who would play AK this way postflop would likely be the type to come in raising with it. All in all it's a fold. Reads on the player would be helpful in narrowing down his likely range of hands.

djoyce003 · #9 03-09-2005, 02:57 PM

This should be in the small stakes no limit/pot limit forum. That aside, beware of limp reraises...i think you are drawing at 2 outs here and are behind to QQ KK or AA...even the unlikely holdings of JJ and 1010 have you killed, but you are more likely crushed by AA if I had to guess.

nova · #10 03-09-2005, 03:14 PM

Another thing that the individual may have been thinking is the whole "see if I flop a set" small pair ploy. The original 'limp' makes this a possibility. Maybe a decent enough pair (8's??) would help the limp, and might have thought you were trying to steal the blinds already having some invested. The limp / reraise does have a chance at being a monster.

I think it's a good fold. Figure that the guy in 2nd position had enough of a hand to see a flop (big connecting cards, possibly 2 of another suit NOT diamonds). Here comes the raiser representing a hand, and overbetting the pot. I wouldn't want to see the next card for that size of a raise where only a 9 would help you.