Throwing Money Away - Intentionally Losing

[memphis_aces]

I've got a scenario I seem to run into a good bit lately and I wanted to see how others felt.

I host homegames on a semi-weekly basis. I really enjoy hosting a game as I love the home-field advantage that seems to exist. I've got a very nice set of chips... nice KEM Cards...an above average table (soon to be very nice), and a nice house so people tend to enjoy playing at my place as well. This is all fine and good but I play with a lot of average to below average players which tends to make things lopsided.

In the last 3 weeks I've hosted about 6 tournaments...I won 3 and finished 2nd in one other. In addition we had a late night 5-handed NL Ring game where I ended up tripling up. It would have been a LOT more but I lost a $50 pot to a runner-runner draw and I started dumping a lot of chips later in the game to keep the other people interested.

Another time, after winning the first two tourneys I ended up going out very early on a call that I never would have made had I been playing to seriously win.

I've found that I've started to play less than optimally at times (or just plain dump cash) in an effort to keep my guests a little more comfortable in order to keep people coming back. I don't really play for the cash, moreso for the game itself. I was just wondering if other players have "stepped down" their game in order to keep the game going (or to keep the people coming back).

Thoughts?

NOTE: This is NOT a bragging thread.... I am not saying I'm the best player ... just saying that I'm the best in this group

EDIT: note that these are not higih-stakes games... just little 20-40 buy in games.... the cash means less to me than at least half of the people in the game....

[warewulf]

If you're hosting, you're probably not the only winner. People come for the competiton. Always play at your top level and give them what they're coming for. I host a regular game and people expect me to make them sweat when I put in a big bet. If someone makes a dumb play, I will take their money. Then again, there are many good players at my game.

However, there are a few decent to bad players that are regulars. They dont mind losing their money as long as they get some action. Some people are ok with losing their money most of the time with hopes of having a good night now and then. It's really about entertainment to many, less about making money.

Don't dump your chips, take all of theirs! You'll probably end up with a waiting list for your game.

Leave books in open view, lend them out if you think you will get them back, etc.

[pdxpuck]

Although I haven't found myself 'dumping chips' necessarily, I do find myself playing much looser in our regular games for these very reasons. I'm not always the host, but after a few wins I start to worry that I am going to lose the game because of my dominance impression. The record speaks otherwise, but people are definitely noticing it when I cash.

Take it for what it's worth, but my solution is to start another game with players who are more interested in the game. I still play in my old game, but the lack of 'serious' poker and the issue you raise has prompted me to get some new faces together for some ring games. I get my fix for regular poker with the new game where we just play straight HE, or Omaha, or stud. No wild cards, no silliness. If they like it, they keep coming and the game gets better. Our stakes are small as well - a 3-4 BB raise may still be $.50, but people still respect it as a notable raise. It's a mindset I suppose...

[wingsfan]

I host a game and end up to the good at most of them too. The only difference is there's no way I'm dumping chips. We play for small stakes and nobody wins or loses anything that's going to hurt them. That being said, I like beating the game. Everybody else at the table, including my wife (actually, especially my wife) loves taking my chips whenever they get the chance. Why shouldn't I play the same way? It's not malicious. We all have a great time. It's just poker, that's all.

[Hedge Henderson]

The game I host is (from what I hear) a very tough game for the limits. I can recall four times during tournaments in which I played less than my very best for one reason or another. In all four, it was heads-up, and my opponent was a player who didn't place high in tournaments very often. I generally tell people that it was late (and it always is), I was tired, and that I was just looking to finish the game.

That statement is pretty much accurate but, what I don't tell my friends is that in all four cases, I didn't really care whether I took first or second. We're not talking about a lot of money, and winning a tournament at our game would simply mean more to some players than it would to me.

I'm not exactly throwing the game, but I take many more chances against some opponents than I would against others. Sometimes I'm up for the 90-minute heads-up match to prove myself, and sometimes I'm not.

When we play cash games, some of us will take it easy on the new guy, and some of us won't. After three years, our game finally has more willing players than seats nearly every week. It took a while, though. A year ago, a new player might break even (or even win) their first night. Today, it usually takes a few games (and lost buy-ins) before they break even for the first time.

It's your game, memphis_aces, so do what you feel is right for it. There's a fine line between shearing the sheep, and skinning them. If you host a good game, you'll have no problem filling seats in the long run. It's just getting over that hump that's the problem and, in that regard, you probably know more about what to do than any of us.

[smoore]

Good post, Hedge... great advice.

BTW... what limits/game is your game tough for? Mine is tough at the $25 max NLHE level.

[MeridianFC]

While I have found as host it takes a lot of doing to keep a game going and newbies and bad players can sometimes get disinterested (heck good players get disinterested too) the luck in the game seems to make results spread around. Next time you get your clocked clean by runner/runner, you'll rethink the soft play.

[mason55]

I was thinking about this on my way into work today for the game I'm hosting tonight. It's mostly people I work with, some of whom I'm also friends with. Last week was our first week and one guy who had never played before hosted. He and his wife both lost their full buy-ins + some more playing 1/2 Limit. I think they lost $100 between the two of them, no biggie.

I found out that he's not playing this week because he looks at poker as an expense and can't afford to lose $100 every week, although apparently his wife is coming to play tonight. My other friend who is the only one in the game with real experience besides me (he plays 3/6 and 4/8 in the casino, i play $200NL, I also play 50NL and 100NL online, so the money doesn't mean much to either of us) and I discussed dumping some chips to her last night. Nothing spectacular, and if she's blowing through her whole buy-in there's no point. But if she's down $10 or even maybe we'll each throw her some chips so that she can leave up for the night.

Like I said, neither of us care about the money, we just want to keep a game going. I could play .1/.2 and be happy, I just want to play and work on my game while I hang out with people I like. Since the money is pretty meaningless it's more important to me to know that I outplayed the other people than to profit. This way they'll come back and I can keep getting practice while they don't get skinned.

Obviously I won't make myself lose money, I just might not win quite as much as I could. Hopefully in a few weeks the poor players will be able to at least hold their own or make a few bucks off each other, I think this will just be a good temporary measure until then.

[memphis_aces]

Great post... thanks for the input

Seems like I'm not the only one who has to soft-play people at times . I'm really torn on it... I assume as the level of the game moves up, I'll be able to play a little harder....

However...right now I think taking small wins from the table in the long term intereste of the game is where I'll be headed....

Very interested in hearing other opionions on this

[edge]

I sometimes play a $5-20 buy-in game with friends, and I don't play anywhere near seriously. I know I could beat the game easily, but after losing pots online and in the casino worth multiple hundreds of dollars, $30 doesn't mean anything to me, whereas if one of the other players were to win $30, it would be lots of fun for him. For that reason, I like to really LAG it up and donate a bit. I'm just playing for fun.

I still feel kind of bad when I lose money playing, even if I know it's because I'm playing like an idiot, but that's just competitiveness.