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#12
10-06-2005, 06:14 PM
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Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
The woman was not kicked off for a political shirt, she was kicked off for public obscenity. I am assuming from the story that the shirt had a clear variation of the F-word. T-shirts, bumper stickers, etc., that contain dirty words are juvenile, offensive, and uncivil. The political content is not relevant.
There are certain things that mature, civilized people do not do in public. A shirt like that is no more appropriate in a public environment than loud cursing or being sloppy drunk. The woman is an idiot. That said, the airline people are idiots too. If the woman had the shirt clearly visible, she should not have been allowed on the plane in the first place. There is no infringement of rights in a policy like that if it is uniformly enforced. [ QUOTE ] Allen Lichtenstein, lawyer for the American Civil Liberties Union in Nevada, said Heasley's T-shirt is "protected" political speech under the Constitution. [/ QUOTE ] The lawyer is an idiot too. Obscenity in a political context is still obscene. 
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#13
10-06-2005, 06:51 PM
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Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
I wonder how Southwest could have changed the rules "in the middle of the flight," and that "the couple decided to leave." If that had really happened, the problem would have been solved instantly, no? [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
Next time, just wear the damned thing inside out and don't get the damned lawyers involved. Then turn it right side out when you're getting off the plane. Wouldn't that have been easier?
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#15
10-06-2005, 07:02 PM
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Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
[ QUOTE ]
...she was ordered to wear her T-shirt inside-out or leave. The couple chose to leave. [/ QUOTE ] Aha, the truth comes out. She wasn't "kicked off" the flight, she chose to get off. [ QUOTE ] Allen Lichtenstein, lawyer for the American Civil Liberties Union in Nevada, said Heasley's T-shirt is "protected" political speech under the Constitution. The real issue, he said, is that the airline allowed her to wear the shirt onboard and then objected only when people complained. [/ QUOTE ] HA! "Protected speech" indeed! Since when does a company have to provide you with service? Now if the airlines and passengers had no problem with this but the government had some rule against it, he might have a case. I don't see how this doesn't get laughed out of court. [ QUOTE ] Heasley said she is in touch with ACLU lawyers in Seattle. She wants Southwest to reimburse the couple for the last leg of their trip and pay for her gasoline, a $68 rental car from Avis and a $70 hotel bill. Before leaving the plane, she said she was told the airline would reimburse her for the tickets for the last leg of the flight. After they got off the plane, they were told they'd be reimbursed only for the taxes on the tickets. McInnis said customer services officials are looking into the matter. [/ QUOTE ] I think Southwest should refund her the last leg of the flight and nothing else. It was her decision to leave the airplane, so she should bear the consequences of that action.
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#16
10-06-2005, 07:25 PM
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Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
I'm constantly amazed by how many people (woman on the plane included) don't seem to understand the meaning of the term Free Speech.
Free Speech does not mean speech without consequences. This woman is fully entitled to wear that shirt AND Southwest is fully entitled to throw her off the flight.
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#17
10-06-2005, 07:43 PM
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Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
[ QUOTE ]
The woman was not kicked off for a political shirt, she was kicked off for public obscenity. I am assuming from the story that the shirt had a clear variation of the F-word. T-shirts, bumper stickers, etc., that contain dirty words are juvenile, offensive, and uncivil. The political content is not relevant. There are certain things that mature, civilized people do not do in public. A shirt like that is no more appropriate in a public environment than loud cursing or being sloppy drunk. The woman is an idiot. That said, the airline people are idiots too. If the woman had the shirt clearly visible, she should not have been allowed on the plane in the first place. There is no infringement of rights in a policy like that if it is uniformly enforced. [ QUOTE ] Allen Lichtenstein, lawyer for the American Civil Liberties Union in Nevada, said Heasley's T-shirt is "protected" political speech under the Constitution. [/ QUOTE ] The lawyer is an idiot too. Obscenity in a political context is still obscene. [/ QUOTE ] This just makes me laugh. That 'clear variation' of the F word, was shown day-and-night on TV and print ads for the mainstream movie referenced. Viewable by impressionable children, etc. etc. Everyone went 'wink wink.' So this notion that the woman wearing the T-shirt was hassled for an 'obscenity,' as opposed to a political opinion, is nonsense. Frank
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#18
10-06-2005, 07:54 PM
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Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
As die-hard of a supporter of the First Amendment I am(and really, I go pretty overboard), I must concede that I side with Southwest on this one, simply because, as the poster before me just implicated, Southwest is not obligated to provide service to anyone.
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#19
10-06-2005, 08:02 PM
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Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
[ QUOTE ]
That 'clear variation' of the F word, was shown day-and-night on TV and print ads for the mainstream movie referenced. Viewable by impressionable children, etc. etc. Everyone went 'wink wink.' So this notion that the woman wearing the T-shirt was hassled for an 'obscenity,' as opposed to a political opinion, is nonsense. Frank [/ QUOTE ] Try reading the posts. The article said that the shirt had "...a phrase similar to the popular film, Meet the Fockers." That means that she was not wearing a "Meet the Fockers" t-shirt. We who read the post are all assuming from the article that the "o" was replaced with a "u" on the shirt, and that was what people objected to.
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#20
10-06-2005, 08:09 PM
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Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
[ QUOTE ]
As die-hard of a supporter of the First Amendment I am(and really, I go pretty overboard), I must concede that I side with Southwest on this one, simply because, as the poster before me just implicated, Southwest is not obligated to provide service to anyone. [/ QUOTE ] The First Amendment protects you from infringement of the right to free speech by the government. I don't have any obligation to afford you free speech, and a company has no obligation to provide anyone with the opportunity to free speech. Contrary to the statements made, Southwest does have a certain obligation to provide service. As a licensed common carrier, it cannot discriminate, and must provide service to anyone who follows its rules. If it has rules that it enforces equally and without discrimination, then it can deny service to anyone who violates those rules.
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