"Culture of Life"

[DVaut1]

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Wow. Just wow.

So many things wrong with this post.

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One of the best points I ever heard was when someone asked "what companies are the two biggest buildings in Boston named after" The Met Life and the Manu-Mutual buildings...two health insurance companies. Health insurance companies have much more power in the US than they ought to.

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Interesting Boston factoid, for sure...but does it really mean anything?

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Yeah, there were so many things wrong with that post -- not the least among them that the two tallest buildings in Boston are the Hancock Tower and the Prudential. I lived in Boston area for a while, and I've never even heard of the MetLife or Manu-Mutual buildings there. I've never even heard of a 'Manu-Mutual' building anywhere.

There's a MetLife building in NYC, and it's pretty tall -- but it's nowhere near the tallest, as far as I know.

"Hancock Tower and the Prudential"

I thought I was wrong on the names.

Those are both insurace companies nevertheless.

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There certainly is a culture of 'you must have the baby you can't afford, but don't expect us to help you raise it'.

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Do I not pay my state and federal income taxes? (We'll leave aside that I donate to charity)

[lehighguy]

I think the key is that you think it isn't alive, or for that matter anything of importance. Whether you place a fetus above inanimate objects or not, it is certainly far below the status of a life. Essentailly placing you in category one.

Or put more simply, if you are asked the yes/no question is a fetus alive, you answer no.

[lehighguy]

Your rudeness aside, I think "we" determined that infant mortality was not the end all statistic in evaluating national healthcare quality.

[DVaut1]

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"Hancock Tower and the Prudential"

I thought I was wrong on the names.

Those are both insurace companies nevertheless.

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True -- but if I'm not mistaken, Prudential Financial sold the building years ago; it's now owned by a real estate development firm that leases the office spaces to various tenants; the building did retain the Prudential name, however.

Regardless, I happen to agree that it's rather unremarkable the two tallest buildings in Boston were named after insurance companies, and don't believe its representative any kind of undue influence on the part of insurance companies, either in Boston or in the country at large.

There's probably much more compelling evidence to demonstrate that insurance companies wield a lot of power than pointing to Boston skyscrapers.

[DVaut1]

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There are only two reasons to support abortion:
1) You don't think the fetus is alive.
2) You think it is alive, but you think murder is ok if it benefits the state/society.

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This is grossly oversimplified -- as it leaves out the possibility that abortion is clearly ending life (that is, abortion kills a live fetus) but that it isn't equal to murder.

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We can't afford to keep everyone alive.

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I don't disagree with this. Surely we have to make some decisions about resource allocation. But consider two cases of terminal illness:

Patient A is conscious and lucid, and clearly indicates that she wants to continue to live.

The doctors treating Patient B say that she is essentially brain-dead and unaware of her surroundings. As best we can tell, she indicated when she was healthy that if she ever were in her present condition, she would want them to pull the plug.

Now, both patients' hospitals are about to pull the plug. If you can only choose one patient to protest for, which one do you go for? Pretty easy decision, right?

So if we add the fact that B's family can pay for her care and A's can't, why should that change the decision? The protestors are saying that the sacred nature of life trumps Patient B's own decision, it trumps her legal guardian's decision, and it trumps her doctors' analysis. Apparently, though, it doesn't trump poverty. This is hypocrisy, plain and simple.

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There are only two reasons to support abortion:
1) You don't think the fetus is alive.
2) You think it is alive, but you think murder is ok if it benefits the state/society.

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By condoning the death of patient A, you are essentially choosing reason #2, except for an adult woman instead of a fetus.

[elwoodblues]

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Or put more simply, if you are asked the yes/no question is a fetus alive, you answer no.

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First, you have no idea what I think on the issue.

Second, one can maintain that a fetus is a form of life that is lesser than someone who has been born. While this form of life has value, the value of the rights of the mother outweigh this life.

[DVaut1]

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Second, one can maintain that a fetus is a form of life that is lesser than someone who has been born.

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I assume this is what most people intuitively/subconsciously believe, whether they admit it/realize it or not.

Perhaps I'm wrong, but there's something relatively incongruous about the belief 'abortion is murder' and the way most behave who hold that belief -- so much so that I'm inclined to say the belief isn't valid.