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#11
09-09-2005, 01:55 PM
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Re: I\'m a douche and I don\'t know my lines
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I would either check/raise the flop or turn. [/ QUOTE ] i'd rather let him keep the lead with AJ-AK (i don't want him to fold these here) than let him 3-bet with AA-TT. dave - a read makes this hand 100% more easy. you need to know if he will bet the river again (or call a bet) with overcards. against really ABC guys you can check call down like this and fold the river if he bets again. against a passive, bad ABC guy (who would call you with ace high and only raise with premium hands) you can bet the river and fold to a raise. against a tricky/laggy guy you just check call the river and hope for the best. [/ QUOTE ] Miles, this advice sounds 100% on-the-money. Thank you! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] --Dave. Edit: This river was 911 * 2517. 
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#12
09-09-2005, 01:56 PM
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Re: I\'m a douche and I don\'t know my lines
[ QUOTE ]
I would either check/raise the flop or turn. [/ QUOTE ] Really? Could you explain your reasoning on that to me? I play 6-max, so this situation comes up for me a lot, and I never really know the best approach to take. Also, could someone explain the merit of the c/c c/c b/f line to me? It seems to me that when you've got bottom pair, you're just asking for trouble with this line, because so often by the river there are two additional overcards to your pair on the board. Obviously in this hand that didn't happen. Is that why you ended up betting the river, Dave? Educate me, poker wise-men!
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#13
09-09-2005, 01:56 PM
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Re: I\'m a douche and I don\'t know my lines
just saw the read Dave has, I think this guy will bet the river for us, I now say, check/call check/call check/call.
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#14
09-09-2005, 01:59 PM
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Re: I\'m a douche and I don\'t know my lines
[ QUOTE ]
I think Dave is assuming the guy has overs here. So, I want to raise and put him in a tough spot. If we raise the flop, he may peel one more, but I think he folds the turn to our bet if it blanks. I don't know if I want him drawing to 6 live outs against our pair of 5's. I would rather take the pot down now. edit: I forgot we have an A, which may have him reverse dominated, so he may not have 6 clean outs. Maybe a wa/wb line is best here. [/ QUOTE ] Guys, look at the read! We don't actually have his WTSD% but I can guarantee you we should not be playing this hand with the intention of making Villain fold. He's folding practically never after 3-betting preflop. And I think the ranges being given are too small. This guy is an 18% PFR 3-betting a CO steal-raise.
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#15
09-09-2005, 01:59 PM
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Re: I\'m a douche and I don\'t know my lines
yup, i completely missed those stats.
i check call the river and expect to win very often.
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#16
09-09-2005, 02:03 PM
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Re: I\'m a douche and I don\'t know my lines
[ QUOTE ]
Guys, look at the read! We don't actually have his WTSD% but I can guarantee you we should not be playing this hand with the intention of making Villain fold. He's folding practically never after 3-betting preflop. And I think the ranges being given are too small. This guy is an 18% PFR 3-betting a CO steal-raise. [/ QUOTE ] see above, I missed the read
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#17
09-09-2005, 02:05 PM
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Re: I\'m a douche and I don\'t know my lines
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Guys, look at the read! We don't actually have his WTSD% but I can guarantee you we should not be playing this hand with the intention of making Villain fold. He's folding practically never after 3-betting preflop. And I think the ranges being given are too small. This guy is an 18% PFR 3-betting a CO steal-raise. [/ QUOTE ] see above, I missed the read [/ QUOTE ] [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
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#18
09-09-2005, 02:28 PM
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Re: I\'m a douche and I don\'t know my lines
[/ QUOTE ] Also, could someone explain the merit of the c/c c/c b/f line to me? [/ QUOTE ] I think that the c/c, c/c, b/f line is the "standard" 2+2 line for when we are either way ahead or way behind (say we have something like A10 on a A63 board and are bet into- we're either way ahead of another pair or way behind to a stronger ace). The rationale for it is that it minimizes our losses when we are behind a better ace but does not let something like KK-JJ check behind us on the river in the example above. If we are raised on the river by a straightforward player who has been betting the entire way then we can safely throw the hand away. Feel free (please) correct me if my understanding is off on this.
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#20
09-09-2005, 02:37 PM
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Re: I\'m a douche and I don\'t know my lines
[ QUOTE ]
I think that the c/c, c/c, b/f line is the "standard" 2+2 line for when we are either way ahead or way behind (say we have something like A10 on a A63 board and are bet into- we're either way ahead of another pair or way behind to a stronger ace). The rationale for it is that it minimizes our losses when we are behind a better ace but does not let something like KK-JJ check behind us on the river in the example above. If we are raised on the river by a straightforward player who has been betting the entire way then we can safely throw the hand away. Feel free (please) correct me if my understanding is off on this. [/ QUOTE ] yea, your right, this has been discussed a bunch. But in this situation, we have a villian who is crazy enough that we do not need to worry about him checking the river, so I think the line here is check/call every street. Same principle, lose the least, win the most, but we don't worry about him checking thru this river, like a more typical passive villian would.
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