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  #21  
Old 12-19-2005, 05:10 PM
tomdemaine tomdemaine is offline
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Default Re: UCLA study concludes left wing bias in media is legit

The concept of a liberal bias is difficult to quantify no matter what metrics you use as your decisions will always be influenced by your own opinions. Noone can ever claim to be wholly unbiased your biases are part of what makes you you. That said I believe that while the majority of media outlets are corporatist and corporate owned, the actual journalists on the ground are mostly center-leftists and that a center-left mindset may lend itself to a journalistic (or acadmeic but that is another debate) life. Where this falls down is that, while left thinking journalists are probably the majority the right thinking ones have much more the courage of their convictions and shout loud enough fot two. I doubt "the right" would trade all the new york times' in the world for one fox news or Rush Limbaugh for getting the point across.
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  #22  
Old 12-19-2005, 05:39 PM
Benman Benman is offline
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Default Re: UCLA study concludes left wing bias in media is legit

All the teeth-gnashing over the so called liberal media bias drives me up the wall. Where is it written that a reporter, or newspaper, must occupy exactly the median center of American politics in order to be credible? Every single person and instituion in this country is somewhat to the left or right. SO FREAKIN' WHAT? Who cares? I'm liberal. The Wall Street Journal is a conservative paper. Guess what? I think it's a fine paper. The New York Times is a liberal paper. Yes I admit that. It's also a good paper too. You people who get all whipped into a frenzy over the liberal press drive me absolutely bonkers. Have you lost all common sense? Get over it. Are you telling me that if the NYT has a front page story about the latest goings on in say Rwanda, and that's a topic you care about, are you saying that you won't read or trust the article just because you figure it was written by some east coast lefty? Do you really feel that way? Do you realize how brainwashed you've become by low-content talk show bloviates? Sorry, this really gets me worked up.
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  #23  
Old 12-19-2005, 05:45 PM
UATrewqaz UATrewqaz is offline
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Default Re: UCLA study concludes left wing bias in media is legit

The particular biases of the media do not really affect the thinking individuals in our society, as they are easily spotted and properly noted in our minds.

Since you're probably more intelligent than the average schmo, as are most of the posters on this forum, the bias, regardless of which way it is, does not particularly affect us.

History has proven however that propaganda can be a very powerful tool, as there are many people in our world who are not deep thinkers and tend to be more sheep-like, believing what they think they "should" ("should" coming from their parents, peers, their pastor/priest/religious leader, and at times media).
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  #24  
Old 12-19-2005, 05:51 PM
tomdemaine tomdemaine is offline
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Default Re: UCLA study concludes left wing bias in media is legit

[ QUOTE ]
The particular biases of the media do not really affect the thinking individuals in our society, as they are easily spotted and properly noted in our minds.

Since you're probably more intelligent than the average schmo, as are most of the posters on this forum, the bias, regardless of which way it is, does not particularly affect us.

History has proven however that propaganda can be a very powerful tool, as there are many people in our world who are not deep thinkers and tend to be more sheep-like, believing what they think they "should" ("should" coming from their parents, peers, their pastor/priest/religious leader, and at times media).

[/ QUOTE ]

The intelligence of any mob = the intelligence of the stupidest member / the total number of members [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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  #25  
Old 12-22-2005, 11:17 AM
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Default Re: UCLA study concludes left wing bias in media is legit

This study rated the ACLU as slightly conservitive (which is accurate),

"Center for Responsive Politics, a group whose primary purpose is the maintenance of databases on political contributions, scored a 66.9, making it highly "liberal."

and

"Center for Strategic and Budgetary Assessments, a defense policy think tank whose board of directors is currently chaired by former Representative Dave McCurdy (D-OK), scored a 33.9, making it more "conservative" than AEI and than the National Taxpayers Union."
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  #26  
Old 12-22-2005, 01:18 PM
BluffTHIS! BluffTHIS! is offline
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Default Re: UCLA study concludes left wing bias in media is legit

[ QUOTE ]
Form the study: "The most centrist outlet proved to be the 'NewsHour With Jim Lehrer'."

I've always felt that show "gets it" and, more often than most, gets it right. I agree with your assessment of most major news outlets.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree andy, that PBS's News Hour is relatively centrist in their reportage and analysis, though not necessarily in what they choose as topics to report on in depth, although that is just a gut feeling.

And outside of Fox, I do feel most media outlets lean left. The question is why would they? And I think that might have something to do with both the vast majority of university journalism departments themselves being run by left leaning proffessors (no big surprise), and the type of students those programs attract.

Also, I believe Cyrus is very wrong about the legitmacy of the criterion used, namely what type of sources are used. As a conservative catholic, there is one sure tipoff to me of a biased report that intimates that a substantial number of catholics disagree with the church's teaching on abortion. And that is if they quote the lying *@#! that runs Catholics For A Free Choice. This is because that organization is not a membership organization at all, but just a mouthpiece funded by liberal endowments to oppose the catholic church on abortion. So that organization really speaks for no catholics, although there are of course many who do disagree with the church's teaching on that matter.

So when various media outlets over the years have used that as a source, I know that they are left biased to the point of not caring about legitimate sources. The same thing can be said regarding consitutional legal questions whe a media outlet always uses Lawrence Tribe for its analysis.
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  #27  
Old 12-22-2005, 01:33 PM
Riverman Riverman is offline
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Default Re: UCLA study concludes left wing bias in media is legit

The thing that really upsets me is that amid the right's 20 year campaign to hammer away at what it sees as media bias they have scared news organizations into providing "balanced" coverage in cases where there is really no need to "balance" anything. An example:

Valerie Plame case: Bush originally says "Anyone involved in outing an undercover agent will not be a part of my administration." So then it becomes pretty damn clear that Rove was involved, and he changes his statement to "Anyone who committed a crime will not be a part of my administration." There is no liberal element to pointing out that he "flip-flopped," and the facts are not up for dispute. Still, major news will put some republican operative, spewing talking points, on to "balance" the coverage.

Another thing that really bothered me is election coverage. At this point it is pretty clear that both the 2000 and 2004 elections had irregularities if not outright cheating in favor of the republican party in Florida and Ohio respectively. Where is the coverage? The MSM went along with the its over lets move on line, even though there is significant evidence of outright corruption (at least in Ohio). Where was the "balanced" discussion on the legitimacy/wisdom of the Supreme Court stepping in to decide Bush v. Gore, particularly when justices who were on record as being strong supporters of "states rights" usurped the authority to decide the election result in Florida?
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  #28  
Old 12-22-2005, 01:37 PM
DVaut1 DVaut1 is offline
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Default Re: UCLA study concludes left wing bias in media is legit

[ QUOTE ]
Also, I believe Cyrus is very wrong about the legitmacy of the criterion used, namely what type of sources are used. As a conservative catholic, there is one sure tipoff to me of a biased report that intimates that a substantial number of catholics disagree with the church's teaching on abortion. And that is if they quote the lying sl*t that runs Catholics For A Free Choice. This is because that organization is not a membership organization at all, but just a mouthpiece funded by liberal endowments to oppose the catholic church on abortion. So that organization really speaks for no catholics, although there are of course many who do disagree with the church's teaching on that matter.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this is a strong reason as to why I'm NOT in strong favor of using 'think-tank citations' as the matrix by which media sources ought to be rated -- often times journalists won't (through carelessness, ignorance, laziness, etc.) bother doing a thorough investigation regarding who and what they cite...and will often cite any organization interested in providing a quote; does journalist X bother investigating the membership rolls/donation records/lobbying history of Advocacy Group Y, or Think Tank Z? I'd guess that sometimes they do (and some of the best political reporters are of course aware of such things anyway, without a formal vetting) -- but I'd suspect a substantial number don't.

And, as you pointed out - the methodology cited in the study wasn't clear (perhaps I missed it) as to how advocacy groups/think tanks were differentiated, if at all; for instance, I think we can all agree that calling the NAACP a think tank is a stretch -- it's an advocacy group that has a clear agenda; and yet it seems the UCLA study classified the NAACP as a think tank.

Claiming the NAACP is an advocacy group ought to be pretty uncontroversial, as anyone with even a cursory knowledge of the organization knows that it has a point of view -- so when a media outlet cites the NAACP, there is, I believe, the implication that such a cited quote is given by someone who works for an advocacy group, not an unbiased party.

Again, I don't necessarily think "think tank citation" is a useless factor that's not worthy of study -- it should just be one factor, IMO, in a mosaic of factors.

Moreover, none of these problems even begin to scratch the surface of the ADA legislator rankings, which I believe were the control in the study -- the ADA rankings are not the best tool for establishing the median position for the average American voter, for a variety of reasons, IMO.

Again, it's not a completely valueless study, but I certainly wouldn't call it exemplary work, either.
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  #29  
Old 12-22-2005, 01:46 PM
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Default Re: UCLA study concludes left wing bias in media is legit

Bias in the media or Bias in the studiers?:

"One of the authors of the study, Groseclose, was a Hoover Institution 2000-2001 national fellow; Milyo, according to his CV, received a $40,500 grant from AEI; and, according to The Philanthropy Roundtable, Groseclose and Milyo were named by Heritage as Salvatori fellows in 1997."
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  #30  
Old 12-22-2005, 01:56 PM
DVaut1 DVaut1 is offline
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Default Re: UCLA study concludes left wing bias in media is legit

[ QUOTE ]
Bias in the media or Bias in the studiers?:

"One of the authors of the study, Groseclose, was a Hoover Institution 2000-2001 national fellow; Milyo, according to his CV, received a $40,500 grant from AEI; and, according to The Philanthropy Roundtable, Groseclose and Milyo were named by Heritage as Salvatori fellows in 1997."

[/ QUOTE ]

If you're directing that question at me...it doesn't seem so much a case of studier bias; it seems to be the case of a sub-par study -- or at the very least, a study where the far-reaching conclusion reached by the researchers ("Media bias proven") isn't in fact proven by the study.

I suppose we could invent some agenda on behalf of the researchers, and claim that some right-wing groups paid a couple of UCLA professors to concoct a study that could be cited in numerous times in the media (knowing the public-at-large won't investigate the specious methodology) so that the right could make a circular reference to it, and give some 'scholarly weight' to their claim that the media is inexorably biased against them -- but such a claim is, in my mind, as equally unprovable as the conclusion reached by the researchers in the study themselves.
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