too much for too little?

BradL · #1 03-25-2005, 03:58 PM

First hand at table, playerview hasnt loaded yet and no notes on button.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
7 folds, Button raises, 1 fold, Hero calls.

Flop: (4.66 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets, Hero calls.

Turn: (3.33 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets, Hero raises, Button calls.

River: (7.33 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets...

Final Pot: 8.33 BB

I called the flop planning to checkraise bluff/semibluff any straight draw or heart. I was going to checkraise a jack and had not quite made up my mind about a king. Obviously the river is automatic but I was pretty unsure about the rest of the hand.

-Brad

JAA · #2 03-25-2005, 04:11 PM

I would really like this line if you had some read on the villain in this hand. Against a random Party $15 player (read:donkey), I don't know how successful you are going to be.

As an aside, I think I'm becoming too dependant on PlayerView. I'm beginning to get uncomfortable the two hands before it loads. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

- Jags

lostinthought · #3 03-25-2005, 04:49 PM

I agree - I like the play, but I like it better against someone I know who has a propensity to fold.

But if it didn't work I am sure it got you some action on later streets.

stoxtrader · #4 03-26-2005, 02:00 AM

I generally c/r this type of flop. and then lead the turn if he calls. I think it's a slightly cheaper way of accomplishing the same thing.

surfdoc · #5 03-26-2005, 02:12 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I generally c/r this type of flop. and then lead the turn if he calls. I think it's a slightly cheaper way of accomplishing the same thing.

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you then laying it down if he calls and pops you back on the turn?

Lestat · #6 03-26-2005, 02:17 AM

Serious question...

If you have a decent feel that your KJ is the best hand, then I think you should definitely play it as such. But do you really think it's necessary to so heavily contest such a small pot in a full game?

In other words, will this make or break you in the Party 15 games? I have to admit, I'll make my stands, but I don't always try to run an unimproved KJ through a stealer like poop through a goose. Many stealers would have ace/type hands that would've made a pair on this board or a straight draw which they are not folding to.

Again, I make my stands. I'll even sometimes bet or check/raise a KJ on an ace-high flop. But usually when I think I could have the best hand. Otherwise, I tend not to sweat the small pots in a full game. Do you think I'm giving up too much in these Party games?

BradL · #7 03-26-2005, 02:17 AM

[ QUOTE ]

Are you then laying it down if he calls and pops you back on the turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the reason I favor waiting for the turn card in a spot like this. It "defines" your hand more clearly in your opponents eyes and leaves less room for him to get fancy without a real hand.

-Brad

surfdoc · #8 03-26-2005, 02:21 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Serious question...

If you have a decent feel that your KJ is the best hand, then I think you should definitely play it as such. But do you really think it's necessary to so heavily contest such a small pot in a full game?

In other words, will this make or break you in the Party 15 games? I have to admit, I'll make my stands, but I don't always try to run an unimproved KJ through a stealer like poop through a goose. Many stealers would have ace/type hands that would've made a pair on this board or a straight draw which they are not folding to.

Again, I make my stands. I'll even sometimes bet or check/raise a KJ on an ace-high flop. But usually when I think I could have the best hand. Otherwise, I tend not to sweat the small pots in a full game. Do you think I'm giving up too much in these Party games?

[/ QUOTE ]

Not at all. I agree. You certainly can't get bullied out of every pot but going apeshit is also not good.

BradL · #9 03-26-2005, 02:23 AM

[ QUOTE ]
But do you really think it's necessary to so heavily contest such a small pot in a full game?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is basically the question I was trying to ask. Not really small pots in general but situations like this where your hand may be best, but it is far more likely a small dog; however, the texture of the board allows for a number of powerful bluffs that your opponent would be hard-pressed to call down with A high unimproved or possibly a baby pair.

-Brad

BradL · #10 03-26-2005, 02:24 AM

[ QUOTE ]
but going apeshit is also not good.

[/ QUOTE ]

Given the texture of the board is this really apeshit? Im not being sarcastic im seriously asking...

-Brad