omfg not another pf Q!!

[Drontier]

sorry guys, what the heck do you do with A2o,A3o,A4o,A5o, A6o in the sb when button limps? What if 2 limpers? I've been completing them, but my winrate for these hands are beyond bad. I think I should open fold them in the bb. Am I just running bad, or way too loose pf?

[Victor]

i play a5o or better sometimes.

[StellarWind]

[ QUOTE ]
sorry guys, what the heck do you do with A2o,A3o,A4o,A5o, A6o in the sb when button limps? What if 2 limpers? I've been completing them, but my winrate for these hands are beyond bad. I think I should open fold them in the bb. Am I just running bad, or way too loose pf?

[/ QUOTE ]
I send the little ones to the bit bucket.

A7o-A5o I usually look left and if I see a passive player I complete. If I think the BB likes bashing limpers then I don't need to be involved.

I just had a new idea. Maybe against 60/20 buttons and tight blinds I should raise to isolate? The idea is that the button would raise with an ace so a flopped ace is an easy win and otherwise I play for my unimproved ace to be the best hand.

Well maybe this is whacky idea. Tell me what you think.

[Drontier]

i think i suck at poker. and am too cheap to buy lessons. free tutoring please?

[TheMetetron]

Muck most of those... limp the middle ones, raise the bigger ones. Tough to understand, I know [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Edit: I'm assuming a 1/2 blind structure, not a 2/3.

[elindauer]

[ QUOTE ]
Muck most of those... limp the middle ones, raise the bigger ones. Tough to understand, I know [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Edit: I'm assuming a 1/2 blind structure, not a 2/3.

[/ QUOTE ]

How often do you think A2 is the currently best hand in this situation?

If we assume that it always beats the button, which is probably pretty close then that just leaves the one random hand in the BB. 12/13 * 11/13 are his odds of no ace / no pair, which means you have the best hand 78% of the time.

Even if you give the button some chance of limping a better ace, you still have the best hand the overwhelming majority of the time. To do anything but raise as a default play seems difficult to defend.

Put it another way... if you were the button, or the big blind, what do you want the SB to do with this hand? I want him to fold, and if not then call, and I'd least like him to raise. So there you go.

-Eric

[Subby]

If the button is limping and the BB has a random hand, shouldn't you presume you have the best hand pf and raise? I realize you are oop, but you get the intiative here and have a pretty decent chance of getting hu.

Or are you just giving BB odds to call with most of his holdings?

[StellarWind]

[ QUOTE ]
If the button is limping and the BB has a random hand, shouldn't you presume you have the best hand pf and raise?

[/ QUOTE ]
The implied odds on this undertaking are horrible. If you raise A4 and get heads up with button there are only two possible outcomes to the hand:

1. You take it down on the flop or turn.

2. You go to showdown and lose.

I'm exaggerating, but the fact remains that you are OOP versus a Villain who has something like T9 and almost always knows who has the best hand. Meanwhile you have no idea if your ace is good or not.

Of course if BB does play and he probably will that's just terrible.

[Subby]

Cool - thanks for taking the time to explain that. I am often guilty of raising and not really understanding why I am doing it...

[sammy_g]

[ QUOTE ]
If you raise A4 and get heads up with button there are only two possible outcomes to the hand:

1. You take it down on the flop or turn.

2. You go to showdown and lose.

[/ QUOTE ]
I frequently win showdowns unimproved in this situation against loose/passive players (and it's mostly loose/passive players who are limping first in on the button). Also what's so bad about (1)?

I don't understand why this is so hard to play. You're out of position, yeah, but people who limp their button first in aren't exactly going to put you to the test postflop.