KK early in Super Monday - Page 3

TheTimeIsUp · #21 11-15-2005, 12:27 AM

In the first level like this, I genereally raise 3.5-4 times.

mlagoo · #22 11-15-2005, 12:36 AM

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5bb is the largest I would ever raise with this, and I will rarely ever do that. Saying it is right to raise 100 in this situation is awful.

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i was studying, and i missed all the discussion on this, so i'd like to respond.

i'm raising to 4-5xBB (usually 4xBB) in the first two levels of a tournament NOT because I want to drive away action AT ALL.

i'm raising to 4-5xBB because there are plenty of people in the first two levels that will call 4-5xBB, and I want to get the most chips possible out of my hands on every street. I think it's the best way to build a pot with a great hand.

I will also raise this amount with anything in my open-raising range in these levels. I really didn't think this was all that controversial.

edit: btw, its good to have you posting again jj.

TheTimeIsUp · #23 11-15-2005, 12:41 AM

I can't argue with raising 4-5bb, it's when it gets to 7-8 that it gets ugly.

You want to maximize value, but you dont want to drive all hands into the muck. As I said previously, 3.5-4 is my standard.

Glad to be posting again [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

#24 11-15-2005, 12:46 AM

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Blinds 10/20

T1070

I raise UTG1 with black KK to 55 and get called by guy with T1665 two to my left. All else fold

No reads, other than table had not been overly loose, more on tighter side.

flop is 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I bet T150, and get raised T350

Pot is now 640 and I have 865 left. Whats my plan?

I am a MTT newb, so please bear with me.

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Results?

jwvdcw · #25 11-15-2005, 12:52 AM

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In the beginning, I'm a lot more concerned with getting a stack to work with than surviving into the second hour so I can survive into the third, and so on.

Kirk

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unless you're a pro who has an opportunity to make big money playing in ring games should you bust out early, I totally disagree.

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the goal is to win *this* tourney, right? what does what I (we) will be doing afterwards have anything to do with it?

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If you're a pro who will make the most money by placing deep in a tourney, but will make more money in side games than spending hours to only get an average payout in a tourney....then you should take a few gambles early on to try to get a big stack, and just go play in your ring games if you bust out.

This only applies to a few people in the world, so its not real pertinent here.

jwvdcw · #26 11-15-2005, 12:53 AM

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i think you need to raise more preflop (t80-100).

why? don't I *want* action here?

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That's pretty awful. This is saying that you are afraid of playing pots postflop.

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huh?

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Sure. Raising this much could work. However, it completely reaks of a monster hand. Why make your hands stick out like that? Poker is about folding hands when you think you have the worst of it, and that is a risk you have to take when playing AA and KK.

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so your disagreeing with the guy who suggested i raise 5xBB and not me being confused by that. right?

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5bb is the largest I would ever raise with this, and I will rarely ever do that. Saying it is right to raise 100 in this situation is awful.

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you would not raise more than 5x BB with KK? So you're inviting small pocket pairs to play against you?

sublime · #27 11-15-2005, 12:53 AM

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Blinds 10/20

T1070

I raise UTG1 with black KK to 55 and get called by guy with T1665 two to my left. All else fold

No reads, other than table had not been overly loose, more on tighter side.

flop is 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I bet T150, and get raised T350

Pot is now 640 and I have 865 left. Whats my plan?

I am a MTT newb, so please bear with me.

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Results?

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i pushed and lost to 99 [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

Jason Strasser · #28 11-15-2005, 12:54 AM

This is how to exploit a certain type of bad player (opening to 150), but it is by far not the right choice here game theory wise. You are saying if you are in the WSOP ME level 1 and u get AA, you gotta open the pot to deny everyone odds to flop a set including implied odds? Yeah, ok.

-Jason

jwvdcw · #29 11-15-2005, 12:54 AM

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I can't argue with raising 4-5bb, it's when it gets to 7-8 that it gets ugly.

You want to maximize value, but you dont want to drive all hands into the muck. As I said previously, 3.5-4 is my standard.

Glad to be posting again [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

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Just to clarify my stance...I 100% disagree with you.

jwvdcw · #30 11-15-2005, 12:55 AM

[ QUOTE ]
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Blinds 10/20

T1070

I raise UTG1 with black KK to 55 and get called by guy with T1665 two to my left. All else fold

No reads, other than table had not been overly loose, more on tighter side.

flop is 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I bet T150, and get raised T350

Pot is now 640 and I have 865 left. Whats my plan?

I am a MTT newb, so please bear with me.

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Results?

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i pushed and lost to 99 [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

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gee what a surprise...a small pocket pair- the exact type of hand I've been saying all along will bust you out when you only raise small with KK or AA.

Note: sarcasm not intended to antagonize you(sorry about your loss)...its directed at those disagreeing here.