King Yao's thoughts on Poker/Trading skill overlap - Page 2

bob2007 · #1 08-31-2005, 02:19 PM

Aren't the traders at the NYSE stock exchange buying stocks for other people? If the thing goes electronic I was thinking those people wouldn't be needed nomore because the electronic system would just match buyers and sellers. Or maybe that's not how it works?

Sniper · #2 09-01-2005, 04:25 PM

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Hahaha, ya stockbroker sure sucks.

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A stockbroker is a salesman position, and a job that is definately less attractive now that more people are eductaing themselves to trading/investing for themselves online.

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Hey I always wondered, if the nyse goes electronic with that archipelago thing, what will the traders do? Wouldn't they no longer be needed?

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When the NYSE goes all electronic, the traders will just "go upstairs". They will not be needed on the trading floor, but they will still serve a useful purpose. Just take a look at the structure of nasdaq trading.

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Another question, if I work out west, wouldn't I have to get up at approx 4 a.m. to see all the news before the premarket opens at 8a.m. in new york?

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Your schedule out west would definately be different than your schedule in New York.

Sniper · #3 09-01-2005, 04:20 PM

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Having read what you said, I've always considered disclosing my gambling career to employers but it definetly seems very risky, depending on their disposition.... I've been successful at poker for the past 3 years, started when I was 17. Pays for tuition.

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Saying "I paid my own way thru college by playing poker", would generally be a plus to many employers. Like any experience you have, its all the way that you spin it. Being able to talk about risk management and evaluating alternatives based on EV are all pluses.

bob2007 · #4 09-01-2005, 08:41 PM

Ya that's exactly how I felt. Needed someone to confirm.

Zygote · #5 09-14-2005, 02:09 AM

Ever think about financial planning?

I live in the GTA and would be in my 3rd year of finance at western had i not dropped out to play poker. Considering i hadn't gone into poker, financial planning is probably what i would've done.

lastsamurai · #6 09-14-2005, 03:07 AM

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Having read what you said, I've always considered disclosing my gambling career to employers but it definetly seems very risky, depending on their disposition. What do you guys think? One financial advisor told me not to because of obvious reasons.

I've been successful at poker for the past 3 years, started when I was 17. Pays for tuition. I have also been successful with sportsbetting with 1000% return in the last year.

I'm a 3rd year finance student University of Toronto (argueably most notable in Canada) looking to get into the investment industry. My marks are only average, and I feel that my only options are: stockbroker or working in mutual funds. I'm considering to move to Las Vegas or New York

Any advice is much appreciated.

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Keep in mind alot of people in the OUTSIDE world still think poker is a form of gambling and will look at you as a degenerate. As for being a stock broker..if you like to sell and are good on the phone...yes go for it. Its a tough grind being a broker...you have your ups and downs..and get to the point where you are wondering where your best intersts are....is it to make your client money or is it to buy that new CL. And this is true for all levels of this industry.... Its a tough industry but as the saying goes...to the victor comes the spoils...... [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

oh btw... Trading stocks is easier than HOLD EM.

bob2007 · #7 09-14-2005, 09:02 PM

Ya I've certainly thought of it. Kinda keeping my options open. Going to a job fair, hopefully I can impress some recruiters. Maybe I'll just hedge my bets and let half of em know about poker and not the other half : ).

Paluka · #8 09-14-2005, 09:18 PM

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Ya I've certainly thought of it. Kinda keeping my options open. Going to a job fair, hopefully I can impress some recruiters. Maybe I'll just hedge my bets and let half of em know about poker and not the other half : ).

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I really think the window for thinking poker may help you is closed anyway. Every single jackass on earth plays poker now, or at least claims to. I think at this point you are better off not mentioning it since the there isn't really any upside anymore.

Sniper · #9 09-14-2005, 10:37 PM

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I think at this point you are better off not mentioning it since the there isn't really any upside anymore.

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The upside is being able to display your skills at money/risk management in a practical rather then theoretical context!

coolhandsun · #10 09-04-2005, 09:04 PM

I'd agree a hundred percent with the relation in skills between trading and poker. I trade for an options market making firm on the west coast. SUSQ actually pulled most of their operation from our floor, but I know a former trader or two from there.

The statement about the "playing poker" with brokers and traders especially rings true. Each trade/quote feels like a hand of poker where neither side wants to expose their holding (order/position). But both sides have small tells. Trying to get the best price or keep an order on your floor fells like eeking out extra big bets. A sense of odds, risk, and value also benefit both very well.

As options trading (and trading in general) goes more electronic, making markets feels a lot like multitabling online poker. Juggling 100+ books involves a fair amount of multi-tasking and staying on top of many situations at a time while avoiding all the possible pitfalls, traps, and mistakes.

Oddly enough, a lot of the guys in my pit play poker during the day. I'm constantly joking on how psyched they are when they pick up a pot, while their being distracted just cost them plenty of opportunities.

I know I hope NYSE goes more electronic. That was def the intention of the merger. Nothing sucks more than having a specialist lean on your stock orders, especially selling short.

Working market hours on the west coast has its ups and downs. I have a hard time going out during the week as I have to be at work by 5:30. But on the flip side I can walk out the door at 1:30 if I want and have 7hrs of daylight. It allowed me to do things like coach a lacrosse team that I never would have been able to do otherwise.

And about exposing your poker to your boss....I actually had "blackjack card counting" on my resume when I applied to my firm out of college.

Gavin