Would you fold this hand on the bubble?

[Apathy]

This is a tempting fold... but do not get too greedy, call this, the short stack has too many chips to give this pot away and expect the other stacks to fold everything except aces and kings, which is I assume why you would fold here.


Also many 20s players dont understand bubble play, In this situation as the big chip leader some guy will fold his stack of like 100 Ill push 5000 with 72o or some crap and get called by AJ or something, Im always shocked what people will call with in this situation at the 20s

[ColdestCall]

[ QUOTE ]
Edit: I'll conclude that discussion by saying SB has too many chips, so I call.
That's the end of the discussion, I'll let you guys post the start and the middle [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Lori

[/ QUOTE ]

What do you think the sweet spot is here for Mr. Hanger Onner Guy's stack (post-hand) if he is still in the game? 2BB, 2.5BB. 3BB? Also, what if the blinds were going up to 150/300 prior to shorty posting again....

Also, what do you think is the correct ratio of your stack to medium stacks?

P.S. I think the sweet spot is around 3BB with a 3 to 2 or greater ratio of your stacks to medium stack, but could be persuaded otherwise.....

[lorinda]

I think I want 4k here, the sb to have 605 and the blinds to be 150-300 next hand.

Just off the top of my head (I'm rather tired)

Lori

[citanul]

[ QUOTE ]
Got it (I believe). Consider folding so that you can continue to bully the table on the bubble. However, if you fold, you're letting the SB back into the game and you hardly have a commanding chip lead. So the safest route is probably the best. Call and get the SB out of the game.

Also, the SB appears to be pulling the old stop-and-go on you. And doing a damn fine job of it, by the way (since you considered folding).

[/ QUOTE ]

How much different are these 2 situations really?

Hero 3100
player 2000
player 2000
player 800

and

Hero 2800
player 2000
player 2000
player 1100

?

I don't totally subscribe to the idea that with these blinds and either of these two stacks, you're going to be able to fully bully the table at your whim. Even with position on the short stack. I think that either of these counts, especially at the blinds level 100/200, aren't exactly optimal for this type of play, and that the situation of the villain having 5.5bb and him having 4bb doesn't change much, if this bullying aspect is relevant.

Adanthar's point about the likelihood of drawing poopy at the higher buyins is true, but I think that you probably should call anyway, since he could just be running said stop and go at you, not just dieing for action with a big hand.

citanul

[citanul]

yeah, that's about the numbers I'd be looking for too.

[lorinda]

Even with position on the short stack. I think that either of these counts, especially at the blinds level 100/200, aren't exactly optimal for this type of play,

Whilst I agree with you, I think Coldest's point was that this made a much better post [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

Lori

[nokona13]

[ QUOTE ]
This is a tempting fold... but do not get too greedy, call this, the short stack has too many chips to give this pot away and expect the other stacks to fold everything except aces and kings, which is I assume why you would fold here.


Also many 20s players dont understand bubble play, In this situation as the big chip leader some guy will fold his stack of like 100 Ill push 5000 with 72o or some crap and get called by AJ or something, Im always shocked what people will call with in this situation at the 20s

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm a little confused by the replies here. Are you saying that as the big stack, you don't want to call an ultra small stack push when you have a medium hand? Are the "sweet spot" comments downstream here talking about how many chips the small stack would have to have before you call his pushes with a less than premium hand?

I geuss I just don't understand the correct play with a big stack against a small/tiny stack on the bubble. Since the small stack is pushing almost any two with only 2-3xBB left, if you're the BB or are already heads up like in this hand, aren't you getting great odds with any medium hand pf or a TPWK hand like this one here post-flop? Or is the risk too great that you'll get sucked out on or the small stack luckily has a premium hand and thus your call lets the small stack back in the game?

[ColdestCall]

[ QUOTE ]
I think I want 4k here, the sb to have 605 and the blinds to be 150-300 next hand.

Just off the top of my head (I'm rather tired)

Lori

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, that sounds better than what I was thinking - I'm prob erring on the side of aggression and greed here. Although I think short stack of 2.5 BB and my stack of 3500 would probably be too close for me to pass up.
It would also, of course, depend on the other players and the table and my table image and yada yada....

[rickofcampbell]

Easy call against most players:
Most players would check a duece.
A lot of players would check a ten hoping the big blind/big stack would bet trying to pick up the pot.
Even if the SB has a ten, if his kicker is 9 or lower the pot will probably be split.

Some players (a minority) might only bet with a ten or better. Then folding is probably okay.

[Scuba Chuck]

100%, there is a huge discussion here, but not for the reason that OP intended.

Sorry Lorinda, but the discussion is exactly what I intended.

I know I have the best hand right now.