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Old 12-18-2005, 05:04 AM
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Default AA on the BB

30/60 party, 10 handed
both villians are right @ 23/13/1.7..

mp1 raises, mp3 cold calls, I'm on the bb w/ AA, I 3 bet, both call....

flop comes KQ3 rainbow... I open, mp1 raises, mp3 cold calls again, I call, planning on a c/r on the turn....

turn is Q... I check (this is probably not the right play, but I was still planning on the c/r).... mp1 bets, mp3 raises.... now what???
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Old 12-18-2005, 05:29 AM
lil feller lil feller is offline
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 66
Default Re: AA on the BB

Since you didn't 3bet the flop, and neither opponent has any reason to put you on AK or better, I think you have to at least call here. MP1 certainly has a K, maybe better. What sort of hands are in MP3's coldcalling range though? Would he cold call preflop w/ KQs, and then do it again on the flop? AQ is also a possibility but you'd expect him to 3bet preflop with that hand as well. QJs is a possibility I suppose, but there aren't too many hands in his range that contain a Q. I'd call the turn raise and see what MP1 does.

If he 3bets, and it isn't capped I call down cuz thats what I do w/ AA. If he 3bets and its capped, muck it. If he just calls, I'd probabaly bet/fold the river.

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Old 12-18-2005, 05:33 AM
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Default Re: AA on the BB

I would usually 3 bet the flop in that spot. With 2 people committed I like the idea of getting more money in right away with the likely best hand. Given the way you played it, I would fold the turn. MP3 cold called the flop raise without even closing the action on a rainbow board, and now he raises the turn. His hand is made, and it is most likely trips or better IMO so I think youre drawing to 2 outs, so folding the turn is what I would do. Also, there is still a small possibility that the MP1 has a Queen which further weakens your hand in this situation.

Also, about your turn play, when your going for a turn checkraise you still have to keep in mind any card that would change your strategy. For instance, lets say the top card paired on the turn making the board KKQ3, obviously you wouldnt checkraise now, instead you may just check and call and try to get to the showdown cheaply or bet/fold depending on your opponents. Another card that can hit the turn that should change your strategy is if a queen hits. When the Queen hits, you should bet out and call a raise or fold to a raise depending on the action and your read on your opponents.

The reason why you should not checkraise when the Queen hits the turn is becuz your hand is now not that strong which means you are now too likely to get 3 bet by a better hand, of course this really isnt a problem since you can safely fold to a 3 bet against most opponents, but youve still lost 2BB with this line even if you fold to the 3 bet. If you bet out you can sometimes fold and lose only one big bet. For instance, if you bet and it goes raise, reraise, you can safely fold, or if you bet and it goes call, raise, you can usually safely fold. If you bet and the action goes raise, fold, or fold, raise, then youll have to call down with no reads. Becuz of the scenarios where you can sometimes save a bet, betting out is better than going for the checkraise IMO. When the Queen hits the turn, your hand is no longer as strong as it was on the flop, thus making checkraising the inferior play relative to betting IMO.
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Old 12-18-2005, 05:59 AM
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Default Re: AA on the BB

Is there any reason why this isnt an easy fold?

What possible hand can someone with a VPIP of 23 coldcall pre-flop, cold call on a flop of KQ3 rainbow then start going gangbusters when a Q hits?

Maybe I am slightly retarded but doesnt MP3 have KQs/KQo here like 115% of the time?

Then there is also the fact that you have 3 bet preflop and MP1 is raising you here. More often then not you are beating him here but there is an "ok" chance of a hand that is beating you here (KK, QQ trying to play cute preflop, perhaps AQs/AQo/KQs/KQo).

MP3 turn raise combined with the "ok" chance MP1 has you beaten here push the decision to a fold IMO.
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