Please help me settle a football argument-Colts

[Indiana]

Edge is no doubt a good RB, but he's also no doubt very expensive. My argument is to let him go and free up some good $ for a stronger defense.

Indy

[IndyGuy]

As has been mentioned before, Harrison was signed to a long term deal last November. Stokely (the 3rd wideout) was also resigned. Both Edge and Reggie Wayne are free agents at the end of this season.

I think the Colts passing attack is so effective because they have so many viable options at wideout. I wonder what the effect will be if the Colts cannot keep Wayne next year. To me that's the bigger question. (And is it just me, or despite the good stats did it seem like Wayne was dropping more passes than normal last night?)

Bill Polian (team pres) has said that keeping Edge is a priority, but it depends on the outcome of the new collective bargaining agreement. They can't throw a ton of money his way without the salary cap going up significantly. They can give him the franchise tag again next year though, if they feel that's the only way to keep him.

I'd expect the Colts to go into the draft looking at what's available in the late first round and second round at running back and see if they can get any steals. If so, it frees up money to spend on defensive talent since the can let Edge sign elsewhere.

[Bulldog]

So refute it.

[Soul Daddy]

[ QUOTE ]
So refute it.

[/ QUOTE ]
Refute what? That Harrison is BY FAR the best receiver on the Colts right now? I don't really think I need to, it's a ridiculous statement. It's obvious that Wayne is at worst a step behind. But he's really not. At 6 years younger, if you'd rather have Harrison, you're insane.

Look at the yards per catch, targets, everything except for TDs over the past year and a half. Watch them play, Wayne is far more explosive, his routes are near as precise. Harrison doesn't draw double coverage anymore, and there are few shutdown corners in the league, so there is no reason that their stats would be equal and Manning would look for them equally unless they are on par with each other. Factor in upside and I'll take Wayne in a second from this point forward.

Congrats on your successful baiting. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[Bulldog]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
So refute it.

[/ QUOTE ]
Refute what? That Harrison is BY FAR the best receiver on the Colts right now? I don't really think I need to, it's a ridiculous statement. It's obvious that Wayne is at worst a step behind. But he's really not. At 6 years younger, if you'd rather have Harrison, you're insane.

Look at the yards per catch, targets, everything except for TDs over the past year and a half. Watch them play, Wayne is far more explosive, his routes are near as precise. Harrison doesn't draw double coverage anymore, and there are few shutdown corners in the league, so there is no reason that their stats would be equal and Manning would look for them equally unless they are on par with each other. Factor in upside and I'll take Wayne in a second from this point forward.

Congrats on your successful baiting. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

"Upside" or "Tremendous Upside Potential"? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Stick with your conclusion. I'll stick with mine:

891 11701 13.1 105

vs

267 3670 13.7 26

Seasons among the league's top 10
Receptions: 1999-2, 2000-1t, 2001-3, 2002-1, 2003-7, 2005-8t
Receiving yards: 1999-1, 2000-6, 2001-2, 2002-1, 2003-6
Receiving TDs: 1999-2t, 2000-2, 2001-2, 2002-3, 2003-4t, 2004-2, 2005-2
Yards from scrimmage: 1999-6, 2002-10
Rush/Receive TDs: 1999-7t, 2000-7t, 2001-4, 2004-4t, 2005-8t
Among the league's all-time top 50
Receptions: 6
Receiving yards: 15
Receiving TDs: 3
Yards from scrimmage: 37
Rush/Receive TDs: 11

vs

Seasons among the league's top 10
Receptions: 2005-8t
Receiving yards: 2004-9
Receiving TDs: 2004-6t
Reggie Wayne is not in the all-time top 50 in any major category.

Plus, by bringing age into the conversation, you are changing the topic. Age is a valid factor when discussing the OPs original question, but this tangent wasn't about "would you rather have Wayne or Harrison going forward", it was about my disputing your claim that Harrison might not currently be the best WR on the Colts.

[Soul Daddy]

Are you offering a semantic argument? That Harrison's status as the best receiver on the Colts has to do with his dominant past, not his present skill level versus Wayne's? Ugh. You know damn well that's not what we're talking about. If Jerry Rice were on the Colts, would he be their best receiver?

The relevant stats, since the start of 2004:

Player Target Rec YD TD YPC
Wayne 178 123 1771 15 14.4
Harrison 207 132 1629 22 12.3

Yeah, not close at all.

[Sluss]

[ QUOTE ]
Wow, I"m surprised at the number of Marvin responses. I really don't think there's any WR I'd choose over Edge in this spot. I also think the days of plugging in D Rhodes or another back-up and getting Edge's numbers are long gone. Edge is an excellent RB. He does a lot of things, like yards after the hit, that a lot of RBs just can't do. And of course running the ball sets the foundation for a good passing game, and tremendously helps a defense.

[/ QUOTE ]

This statement isn't exactly true. The way the Colts offense is set up they are a pass first team. When Manning sees 7 or 6 men in the box he hands the ball to the Edge. Any decent running back can have good numbers against a consistent 7 or 6 man front.

I'm not sure Harrison is more valuable than James. I just think that with the current set-up of the Colts offense they don't need a great running back to put up good numbers and an effective running game.

[MCS]

Edgerrin James.

[SossMan]

I think as a rule, I would rather have a dominant WR than a dominant RB for a number of reasons. For the most part, dominant RBs are a product of their line. They are becoming much more 'plug and play' than any other position. Also, WRs tend to be more durable and play longer at a higher level.

In this case, because of age, I would tend to lean towards Edge. But in most cases, I would take a TO type player (off the field antics notwithstanding) before a Shaun Alexander calibur player.

[Jack of Arcades]

Edge's value comes not just from his running, but his value in the passing game. Backs that can have great years in the passing game are immensely valuable. That said, running backs have a very high risk of injury so giving out contracts with lots of guaranteed money to a rb at his peak wouldn't be smart.

The Colts should be very quick to do what the Pats do: have a maximum number of $$ they're willing to spend on the HB position, and don't go over it. It's not worth it. They can have an effective ground game without busting the bank and work on spending that money elsewhere. Like on, say, Reggie Wayne.