AKs.

-Skeme- · #1 11-13-2005, 02:41 PM

No reads. What's Hero's turn action? I'll follow up with my move after a significant amount of replies.. and then onto the river. Thanks.

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PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (8 handed)

BB ($154.70)
UTG ($214.50)
UTG+1 ($258.50)
MP1 ($404.20)
MP2 ($63.15)
CO ($199.80)
Hero ($221.05)
SB ($41)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
2 folds, MP1 calls $2, 1 fold, CO calls $2, Hero raises to $12, SB calls $11, BB calls $10, MP1 folds, CO folds.

Flop: ($40) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, BB bets $12, Hero calls $12, SB folds.

Turn: ($64) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero ??
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AllIn3High · #2 11-13-2005, 02:45 PM

I'd bet $50, fold to a raise and then check the river through. If he bets the river again i probably fold unless i'm getting a good price to look him up.

emil3000 · #3 11-13-2005, 02:50 PM

I would check. It would have to be a very bad opponent to call with a worse king here, and while there are some gutshots to worry about, I think the added value you might get from the hands you beat make up for the free card. Pot control is not an important factor here, as you'd be folding to a raise if you bet but still something I guess.

stu-unger · #4 11-13-2005, 03:03 PM

i vote check. i think there are more hands that we beat that will bet the river, than call a bet on the turn. i think that we let weaker kings off the hook by betting the turn and get c/r'ed by most hands that beat us.

kitaristi0 · #5 11-13-2005, 03:12 PM

I try to check this down. So check behind on the turn and call a reasonable bet on the river.

scdavis0 · #6 11-13-2005, 03:12 PM

I'd also check, but I'm raising the flop and taking the initiative back.

-Skeme- · #7 11-13-2005, 03:40 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'd also check, but I'm raising the flop and taking the initiative back.

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't raise the flop for a few reasons.. the main reason being that I figure to be way ahead or way behind. If I hand like KJo is leading into me, he's a 3:1 dog on the flop, so I'm not very worried about it. If I am already crushed by a set or the made straight, I am losing less. If he bets again on the turn, which I figure these hands to do, I can fold. If they check, I can take back the initiative by betting, which is what I did.

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PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (8 handed)

BB ($154.70)
UTG ($214.50)
UTG+1 ($258.50)
MP1 ($404.20)
MP2 ($63.15)
CO ($199.80)
Hero ($221.05)
SB ($41)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
2 folds, MP1 calls $2, 1 fold, CO calls $2, Hero raises to $12, SB calls

$11, BB calls $10, MP1 folds, CO folds.

Flop: ($40) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, BB bets $12, Hero calls $12, SB folds.

Turn: ($64) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $30, BB raises to $60, Hero ??
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Ugh.. I figured I couldn't give a free card here. I wanted to define the hand. Opponent showed weakness by slowing down so I figured a bet was neccessary. Perhaps a check behind and perhaps a call on the river is better?

#8 11-13-2005, 03:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
If he bets again on the turn, which I figure these hands to do, I can fold. If they check, I can take back the initiative by betting, which is what I did.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this is the problem with not raising the flop. Its too easy for someone to bet twice with a weaker king or a queen.

If I sensed the slightest bit of weakness in your flop call, I'd bet again on the turn.

EDIT-- I didn't read the action on the turn that was just posted. This is also something that happens if you don't raise the flop. You don't know if he was betting into you with a queen, or a king.

kitaristi0 · #9 11-13-2005, 03:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Perhaps a check behind and perhaps a call on the river is better?

[/ QUOTE ]

Definitely. I might fold the hand now. I really don't like that check/raise.

-Skeme- · #10 11-13-2005, 03:56 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I think this is the problem with not raising the flop. Its too easy for someone to bet twice with a weaker king or a queen.

[/ QUOTE ]

If this guy leads into me TWICE for a healthy bet with a crappy King, good for him, I'm folding. I do not see many people doing this without a better hand. Not at $200 NL and not against myself as I have a pretty solid image, or so I'd like to think. I just don't think this is a great hand in this spot. Against known aggressive opponents I'd probably raise the flop, but against unknowns, I like a call.

[ QUOTE ]
If I sensed the slightest bit of weakness in your flop call, I'd bet again on the turn

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, but I assume you're a decent poker player. A lot of people suck.

[ QUOTE ]
This is also something that happens if you don't raise the flop. You don't know if he was betting into you with a queen, or a king.

[/ QUOTE ]

If I raise, and he calls, how exactly does that narrow down his holdings? He could still have AK, AQ, KQ, JT, 99, Q9, QJ, KJ, etc. Bleh. I think an element we are forgetting here is that, assuming this guy has AQ or something, I've gotten extremely unlucky on the turn. 90% of the time, the turn does not help him.

[ QUOTE ]
Definitely. I might fold the hand now. I really don't like that check/raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think it comes down to reads on the player. I don't want to give a free card here, but I also don't want to get CR. I think a bet is reasonable. AAArrghh.. jeah, maybe a check is best. All in favor?