Could you make this call?

rwanger · #1 03-10-2005, 10:49 AM

$400nl party.

You pick up AA. 1 fold. Villan, (who has been raising a few too many hands, but you have won a few non showdown pots off of him recently with only moderately sized bets) raises to $12. You re-raise to $24. All fold back to villan who calls. Flop 752 rainbow. Villan checks. You bet $25. Villan calls.

Turn is a 5, putting two diamonds on board. Villan checks, you bet $25, villan check-raises to $100. He had been sitting for 20 or 30 minutes and this was his first check raise. You call.

River is T of diamonds, putting 3 diamonds on board. Pot is $300. Villan is all in for his last $200.

(the amounts are not exact I know, but I don't have the HH here with me)

Can you call this?

ggbman · #2 03-10-2005, 11:20 AM

You must re-raise more preflop to define his range of hands

flawless_victory · #3 03-10-2005, 11:23 AM

raise more preflop, or dont raise... the PF is HORRIBLE. flop, bet more... turn, even worse than the flop. you think this guy is likely to get all his money in the middle on this board with a hand that loses to AA? bet ALOT more... not really? check it. not as if your too scared of a free card beating you. if you check the turn, call anything reasonable on the end no matter what card come off. could i make the river call?? uhhmmm??? are you INSANE? more like, could i make this huge laydown? i would call, most likely. is this 6max? in a ring game most people will not raise PF in EP with a hand that beats yours on this board.

MrTop · #4 03-10-2005, 12:16 PM

I think that your pre-flop raise should have been bigger or just flat call. The flop and turn bet are also too small. With that board, I'd go for a pot sized bet. Keep the pressure on this guy. Is he going to go to the felt needing runner/runner? A call of a bigger flop bet after a bigger preflop bet will all but commit his stack at this point. Make him make a mistake.

rwanger · #5 03-10-2005, 12:34 PM

So, actually, I was the villian. And I had 97h. I believed his turn bet was a sign of weakness, and raised him. When he called, I put him on an overpair he wasn't too comfortable with, and thought that he would likely fold to a huge river bet. He called almost instantly. I've been working on going with my reads, and my read was psuedo-correct (he had an overpair, though it doesn't take a genius to figure that out). The problem is that he called without even thinking too long on the river.

Did I play this horribly wrong or was he being stubborn in not laying down AA?

Wayfare · #6 03-10-2005, 12:43 PM

You made a move that went right over the guy's head.

HoldEm_Hero · #7 03-10-2005, 01:07 PM

Horrible PF. Push the turn after CR.

Yeti · #8 03-10-2005, 01:15 PM

Here's a little tip. People who minraise with AA preflop aren't likely to be folding them under any circumstances.

rwanger · #9 03-10-2005, 01:44 PM

When a guy min raises preflop. Bets 1/2 pot on flop. Then 1/4 pot on the turn...doesn't it seem like he isn't that comitted to his hand? If you were trying to milk someone, wouldn't you make bigger bets? If I could call the turn for $25 into a $125 pot and be able to get $275 more out of him on the river because he won't lay down aces, I'm getting 12:1 implied odds on a call.

Maybe I just answered my own question. Take the implied odds and a shot at rivering something higher than 1 pair. Although in this specific scenario I only had 2 outs because I put him on an overpair and a pair was on board.

In the end I'm wondering if this was just a crazy play on my part, or could I reasonably expect someone to lay down AA-JJ here enough to make the move profitable? (In this scenario, I don't think it would have made a difference if this player held JJ because I don't believe that he would fear me turning over an overpair, based on my play).