Another Bruiser Folding Hand

[Roswell]

Ok, assuming the game is full:

1) Preflop call is fine
2) Flop raise is good
3) Depending on the player: There is a chance he has A8, suited or unsuited. You are probably committed to this hand, and you should pay off. You only have to be right about 1 out of 8 times.

Kepp in mind this is limit holdem against donks on Party. The only way you could fold this hand is against a player you know well in a live game.

[ggbman]

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Ok, assuming the game is full:

1) Preflop call is fine
2) Flop raise is good
3) Depending on the player: There is a chance he has A8, suited or unsuited. You are probably committed to this hand, and you should pay off. You only have to be right about 1 out of 8 times.

Kepp in mind this is limit holdem against donks on Party. The only way you could fold this hand is against a player you know well in a live game.

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This logic is horrible, if you're reverse dominated on the flop you have 3 outs. If he has any pair your a dog. This is not even close to an auto-call down.

[LarsVegas]

Reserved dominated? That would be AK vs AT on a T-9-4 flop. How on earth can TT be playing 3 outs if reversed dominated.

Also, note that Hero can improve to beat villain's possible overpair. If he calls down here, he will improve about 10% of the time to beat the overpair, and he also has one big bet in implied odds for those circumstances.

I think hero should call the turn getting excellent odds, hoping to see a Ten, and "knowing" he's beat if another diamond comes off. If the turn blanks, hero should note that he now is a major, 2-to-1 favourite over AdKd or similar hands, which would very likely 3bet the flop.

lars

[James282]

Bruiser, people in this game will three-bet you with the overcards or A8s or 99 or even 77 a lot of times. But if you three-bet this preflop your postflop situation would be a lot more easy to wade through.
-James

[Nate tha' Great]

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Bruiser that preflop coldcall is brutal, especially in a six handed game. If you had three bet the hand would have been a lot easier to play. Anyhow Im not crazy this fold without some good player info. Shorthanded these guys will raise all sorts of stuff, even UTG. This is close but I get to a showdown here.

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The cold call is pretty bad period in the Party 15/30. Brusier, I think you're still carrying some NL habits into the game with you. TT is a really good hand in limit hold em.

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I tend to auto-three bet TT is any situation, but Nate if there's any situation to cold call with TT, it's here right? UTG raised, UTG+1 called, so right now there are some hands out there. And there are still several people left behind us.

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The only time I'd call here is if UTG is extremely tight, and I'm playing mostly for set value, or maybe to call down if the board is rags and I can do it cheaply. But ... yeah ... I have exactly 1 cold call with TT in my entire database, so we are talking pretty rare circumstnaces IMO.

[KellyRae]

UTG cannot have both an overpair and a flush draw. Either 10diamonds is good or he's already ahead.

[Saborion]

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UTG cannot have both an overpair and a flush draw. Either 10diamonds is good or he's already ahead.

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No, but UTG can have AdAx or KdKx and get a flush redraw if Hero hits the Td. That combined with "only" 16:1 in pot odds makes me wonder if it's worth it. I'm weak though, hence the question to Smiley.

[theBruiser500]

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Bruiser, people in this game will three-bet you with the overcards or A8s or 99 or even 77 a lot of times. But if you three-bet this preflop your postflop situation would be a lot more easy to wade through.
-James

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True I accept that but in this situation he has to UTG raise AND 3 bet out of position on this flop with those hands.

[theBruiser500]

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I think hero should call the turn getting excellent odds, hoping to see a Ten, and "knowing" he's beat if another diamond comes off. If the turn blanks, hero should note that he now is a major, 2-to-1 favourite over AdKd or similar hands, which would very likely 3bet the flop.

lars

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JJ - AA there are 24 combos, AKs AQs and KQs are 3 combos, 8:1 and his overcard draws have a lot of equity, although this doesn't include the times I have him beat so maybe it is a calldown.

[SmileyEH]

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You are getting 16-1. I think thats enough to spike your 2 outer even if you think you are behind more than 4 times out of 5.

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Without the T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], is it really worth it?

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Its surely marginal either way, but I'd rather peel one off than fold getting 16-1. Metagame, whatever - I would not like to have the sort of image this fold might create.

-SmileyEH