early stages against total idiots

[pindawg]

[ QUOTE ]
this a leak in your game

[/ QUOTE ]

It would be a leak in your style of play, but its how i play. I have had fine success being loose/aggr in the early rounds in tournies. I like to see alot of flops with a wide range of hands. Obviously all the table dynamics determine what I play, when and why.

[Exitonly]

[ QUOTE ]
this a leak in your game

[/ QUOTE ]

playing AJs is a leak? What?

[stoli]

and you have read harrington on hold'em and supersystem right? I think it's a little weak to be folding, I can see just calling and playing them carefully as a speculative hand. The KJs was in the last middle position spot and folded to me and the AJs is up front so should probably just be limped with and played ultra carefully hoping to pick up a flush draw or straight draw.

[dmk]

Is this thread a joke? Are you guys seriously arguing the preflop action on both of these hands? How about you pay attention to the streets that matter here.

I don't think hand 1 is necessarily an easy fold. I'm not sure why you included hand 2 in this post or why this would have to be a total idiot. Maybe he has KQ/KJ? Dunno, but I'm not sure why its included given the title of the post.

Regarding hand 1, what range do you think BB has? Also, do you think you call w/ A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]Ax here?

[pindawg]

Hand1, i guess the bb made a good bet. Theres no way you can call this without super reads. Wait for a better spot to take this donkeys chips.

Hand 2 becomes an easy fold. I like the continuation bet, but I would have made it 80 or 90.

[stoli]

About including the second hand.. I was including it just because It is indicative of the the problem i am having. I get check-raised a large amount or all-in and I don't believe they have it necessarily but also don't want to risk everything with a marginal holding or a coin-flip situation.

I guess the main thing I'm talking about is that it is
these check-raises and overbets are hard to interpret. From a good player a lot of times it means they want you to go away. And against a lot of weak players they think they are making a value bet and they do it with the nuts rather than extracting money with pot sized bets.

Thanks for chiming in about people answering the relevant questions in the post, I appreciate that. As for hand one It was like the third hand of the game so it was difficult putting him on a range without ever seeing him play a hand before so I had to believe that he had two pair, the straight, or a draw that will come in a decent amount of the time. I mean i wasn't prepared to put my whole tourney on the line with top pair on against a coordinated board..


Thanks for the help and all of your past posts they have helped tons!!

[mlagoo]

people have different playing styles, but to call this dude a donk for playing KJ and AJ for a raise is stupid. it's called playing a loose aggressive style. many people do it with a great deal of success, in online MTTs and in deepstack tourneys.

As for the preflop action -- in the first hand, if you're going to raise, you need to make it a meaningful amount. Raising to 3xBB in level 1 makes every limper and the BB have implied odds to call you hoping to stack you. My general rule (stole it from someone else) is 4-5xBB + 1BB for each limper.

Limping with this hand isn't bad, folding is bad. The ability to play marginal hands is what makes a decent tournament player good. You only really get two levels in an online tournament where you are given a significant amount of freedom in post-flop play. Take advantage of them. Folding this hand in an unraised pot preflop is criminal.

On the flop I probably fold there, but I will call that silly bet in some tournaments depending on the buyin. A lot of people will make that bet with AT or QJ or a lot of pocket pairs, because they love to put preflop raisers on a whiffed AK (the only hand they beat).

On the second hand, I don't like the raise from EP with AJs. Just limp. One of the tricks to playing marginal hands is to not get involved with them (and especially not to build a pot with them) OOP, because they become much harder to play.

On the flop, it's an easy fold. Nothing exciting here. You made a CB, he raised you (bluff or not), hand over.

[JustPlayingSmart]

Against the idiots on Party, you need to try to create as many opportunities for them to give you their stacks as possible. Thus, KJs and AJs should not be folded preflop in unraised pots.

[adanthar]

[ QUOTE ]
Harrington says in early position when nobody has entered the pot: AJ suited use a mixture of half raises and half calls. But you say this is a clear fold pre-flop.

"With KJs in middle position I would play in all middle positions with a mixture of 40 percent calls and 60 percent raises"

[/ QUOTE ]

First off, both of Harrington's books are dangerous and the second one is just plain bad, IMO (the first one is great but can be read the wrong way a lot.) In any event, he's talking about really deep stacks and this doesn't have much to do with Party tournaments. I would overlimp the KJs and mix raises/calls with the AJs since the pot hasn't been opened yet.

Having said that, given you essentially have to be best a little under 50% of the time, I think that given the donk's likely range, Hand 1 is a call.

[ QUOTE ]
this a leak in your game

[/ QUOTE ]

I cant see that as a leak if you know when you need to get out of the hand postflop. If you dont know, its most certainly a leak that will cost you alot of chips during tournaments but I think Sam T knows when to get out of the hand postflop and thats why I wouldnt say this is a leak. I have no idea what I would have done with AJ off suit, probably call 40% and fold 60% but with AJ suited, im at least calling 100% of the time.