Mid pocket pairs in mid stages

[ravensfan]

At the risk of being extremely general: what do you do with mid pocket pairs like say 88-10 when you're semi short stacked... maybe 1k-1500 at Level 4/5 and between 5-7 players left. In mid/late position and limpers/callers, do you limp and play for the set value, do you raise hard, etc... I mean, if you raise 3x+1/limper of something, won't you be exposed if they call, an overcard hits on the flop and they bet out at you? My thinking is that one might want to go induce a raise to go all-in, or play for the set value.

It's just that I don't often seem to win with these hands. I'll call the BB and then have to fold when they bet...

Any comments/advise would be great!

[johnnybeef]

[ QUOTE ]
Any comments/advise would be great!

[/ QUOTE ]

find a real team. that ring belongs in cleveland.

[bkbluedevil]

Meh the stacks and my position of the limpers matters so much so its hard to be this general. Usually if there are other limpers I will limp also. First in I almost always raise.

[ravensfan]

Granted it's very general... If you raise when you're first in, what do you do if some player who's neither tight nor loose raises you?
Do you consider yourself loose or tight?

[ravensfan]

lol, sorry bro... You can still cheer for them if you want though... I mean, it was your franchise too. : )

[bkbluedevil]

Um, it depends so much. Where was I raising from? Who raised me? Where was he raising from? How much? What does he think of me? What does he think I think of him? Who has position on the flop? How deep are the stacks? Do I think I have any implied odds to flop a set? Do I even need to flop a set? Sorry I realize this isn't that helpful but these are some of the things you need to consider. If you post a specific hand I could help out a lot more.

[ravensfan]

Yeah, I understand it's pretty general... definitely too general. One of my problems is that I don't play on party too much and I don't know how to import my hands [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]
Also, i guess i was looking for general guidelines from which to adjust my play... So let's take a for instance:

Case 1) Blinds: 50/100. 6 players. You're dealt 99, and have $1500 at party. You're one before dealer, one limper ($1200) - tight thus far, hasn't player too many hands.
Option I: You make standard raise to $400, dealer (has $1800 is fairly agro, showed one hand early won good pot with say top pair, mid kicker - raised with KJ, called down a few bets to show a pair of kings early to win mid sized pot of $300) raises to $800. Everyone folds to you. Calling - the stop and go isn't it? seems early though - will force you to bet into him when there's overcards, raising might be walking into something.
Now what if the dealer is tight and raises to this level?

Option II: You call and pray for the 9 to hit. But the dealer who's agro still raises right?


Case 2: Blinds $100/$200, dealt 88, no limpers, agro with $2300 to your right raised $600, you have $1400 with 5 left at table. Very few reads since you've been 4/5 tabling all night [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img].
This time you're the dealer. What to do? Do you raise, all in, or do fold.
What if instead of one raiser, there's a raiser and a caller both with mid stacks about your size.
or what if there's 2 callers, one with a sizable stack who plays tight agro?

I know there's a lot of questions here, but i'm wondering about the general strength of these cards on a broad scale and when to push hard...
Thanks for your help!

[wulfheir]

Here's an example how NOT to play a mid pair. Special interest should be taken in my post flop play, I'm the type of player that makes the $11s highly profitable.

This gem gave me my first 10th place finish.

NL Hold'em $10 Buy-in + $1 Entry Fee Trny:13676193 Level:2 Blinds(15/30) - Tuesday, July 05, 18:00:56 EDT 2005
Table Table 35131 (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 5: JACJOR ( $965 )
Seat 8: straighthand ( $1235 )
Seat 3: RattleMyCage ( $520 )
Seat 1: nickelcity76 ( $670 )
Seat 2: bandits8 ( $1190 )
Seat 7: Faxgubben ( $775 )
Seat 4: realsangaman ( $470 )
Seat 6: noinfo111 ( $745 )
Seat 10: Rake_ ( $670 )
Seat 9: rock110 ( $760 )
Trny:13676193 Level:2
Blinds(15/30)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to nickelcity76 [ 9h 9c ]
>You have options at Table 35239 Table!.
>You have options at Table 35036 Table!.
Faxgubben calls [30].
straighthand folds.
rock110 folds.
Rake_ calls [30].
nickelcity76 calls [30].
bandits8 folds.
RattleMyCage folds.
>You have options at Table 11059 Table!.
realsangaman folds.
JACJOR calls [15].
noinfo111 checks.
** Dealing Flop ** [ 2d, 4h, 7s ]
JACJOR checks.
noinfo111 checks.
Faxgubben checks.
Rake_ checks.
nickelcity76 bets [75].
JACJOR calls [75].
noinfo111 folds.
>You have options at Table 11059 Table!.
Faxgubben raises [250].
Rake_ folds.
>You have options at Table 35036 Table!.
nickelcity76 is all-In [565]
JACJOR folds.
Faxgubben calls [390].
** Dealing Turn ** [ Kc ]
** Dealing River ** [ Td ]
>You have options at Table 35036 Table!.
Faxgubben shows [ 2c, 2h ] three of a kind, twos.
nickelcity76 shows [ 9h, 9c ] a pair of nines.
Faxgubben wins 1505 chips from the main pot with three of a kind, twos.
nickelcity76 finished in tenth place.
nickelcity76 has left the table.

[ravensfan]

Ouch. Yeah, i'd probably have tried to stay out of a big pot that early with that many players... But hindsight is a lot easier.

[gildwulf]

I don't see anything wrong with this play.