Some words on AA and big pairs

[JJNJustin]

I know a lot of low limit players get AA and lose on them and go bezerk. I have some advice on how to lose the least on AA in a limit game.

You must remember that AA is no more than 5 to 1 favorite against a small pair and 8 to 1 over hands like KQ. Since you will usually be raising/reraising before the flop with what you know is the best hand, the trouble becomes whether they are still good on the flop or not. So, most of the time, when you are playing AA against many players, you will be trying to look for cues as to whether they are still good or not. Problem is, however, many good players get a kick out of giving you false cues to make you "lay down" incorrectly. Lets look at three different situation:

1) Someone has flopped a set. The cardinal sign that someone has flopped a set is if someone starts showing aggression on the flop who did not show aggression before the flop. If you have raised and say someone reraised and a few guys called and you capped and now one of the "callers" starts raising you and the other raiser, look out. His hand has somehow improved to beat a "big pair" which is what he puts you on. Now if the other players dont read the writing on the wall and get stuck in there, you dont make that mistake. For example, you raise, someone calls the raise, someone else reraises, two guys call, you cap it and the caller caps it. Now if you bet the flop and get raised by someone other than the three better or more over if you get check raised, before you call, look at the flop, think of all the bets this is going to cost you on the turn and river and think of all those guys who are going to stay in there and be suckers. Lay down before you call the check raise. Even if you lay down incorrectly once in a while, you have only lost a few bets and think of all the bets you will save when you are beaten (as you suspect it might be).

Still not convinced? Consider this situation: The flop comes a K74 and you bet, get raised, the three better re-raises and it's two bets back to you. Before the thought "Maybe he has AK" goes through your head, consider that he might have KKK and the other raiser might have 777 or 444 and you might be caught in a whipsaw. However, this is a harder lay down than the first, because you have to act before you see what the other caller does.

Deciphering when someone is trying get you to fold your big pair from when you actually might be beat.

For example: You raise with QQ, get called and the flop comes K98 and the small blind leads into you. You fear he has a king but arent sure. If you raise he might reraise with a king or draw, making you fold too often. The best play is to just call. Now, if you get heads up on the turn, you have to call all the way. And alas, you see a king or maybe the river comes an Ace and he bets and you fold to his busted draw or you call his Aces up.

The main point is this: when called by 5 or more players, all of which hold a 6-1 underdog to your hand, it is more likely that you have been beat. Not absolutely sure, but more possible. Sometimes you will be called by a lone 8-1 underdog and be beaten. Many times you will have to just call.

Red flags:

with AA)1) someone who was calling before the flop starts getting very aggressive on a flop of middle cards.
2) the board pairs a face card like JJ or QQ, especially on the turn or river.

with KK: 1) you get involved in a preflop raising war with someone who caps it on you and the flop comes Qxx. If he check raises you on the turn, more likely he has QQQ or AA.
If he comes out betting you on the flop, though, you should raise.

Playing big pairs constantly puts you in the position of thinking "Are these still good?" And many times the board wont be that threatening, but you are beat, and many times the board will look ugly as hell and your pair is still good. You need to be careful about laying down your pair, especially if some opponents "feel" your fear or dislike of the board. They may (and often do) try to get you to fold your best hand. If you just cant help feeling scared of the board, you have to realize that it is more likely for players to make a play at you. If you have players to act behind you, it is even more undesirable situation.
For example, you raise with KK and get called by 4 players. The flop comes 587. You bet and get called by 3 players. The turn is a 6. You have a terrified look on your face. The small blind now bets into you. You realize that you could easily be beat by a lone 4, 9, or even two pair. And you have 2 players to act behind you. Does the small blind really have you beat ? What do you do? Well if he really did have any of that flop he probably would have bet it, and if he turned the upper end of the gut shot he probably would have went for a check raise. Still, he is in the blind and he may be betting for fear you wont bet.


A similiar situation is when you raise the blind with JJ and the flop comes AQ7 and the bb bets into you, heads up. JJ Could still be good, but he could very easily have you beat with A3, which he called, because he had an ace.

Besides getting all caught up in the board and how scary it is, when playing big pairs, always keep in mind, how likely is it for this player to be trying to get me off my pair. The more likely, the more you have to call. Now if it gets raised behind you and the first guy calls, you should probably fold. But these are tough situations. Nobody plays them perfectly everytime.

Differentiating between someone who is trying to move you off your pair and someone who has outdrawn you is extremely tough. Look for the red flags mentioned above. Lastly, one thing that amateurs do that I think is really bad is that when they cant beat top pair on board and get bet into is hesitate really really really long painstakingly before deciding what to do. You are basically telling the bettor you can not beat top pair and that if he keeps betting you will probably fold. Given this, you have to call all the way. You have basically given him the greenlight to either bet his bluff or bet his top pair all the way without fear. Try not to do this. A good response is to say "I call" right away without hesitation. Now your opponent has no idea what you have. He doesnt know if you have top pair or a set and might be slow playing him. He certainly doesnt know if he can continue the bluff because you have called so quickly. Most importantly, though he doesnt know that you have a big pair that cant be top pair. He will mostly likely now check the turn. You can check behind him or you can bet. Either is okay. If you check behind him, always call on the river if he bets. If you bet the turn and get called, you should probably check it down on the river. If you get check raised, you are in that dilema- is he trying to get you off your pair or does he have you beat.

Playing big pairs in these situations is tough. The big thing to remember is that one out of 6 players with 6 to 1 underdogs, someone will usually show you a better hand, but not always. Against 1 player, you need to call a lot more. Against 6, you need to lay down a lot more. But not always. Does this help?


-J

[shant]

This post is weak tight and too long.

[brazilio]

I fold JJ and QQ preflop too, buddy.

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For example: You raise with QQ, get called and the flop comes K98 and the small blind leads into you. You fear he has a king but arent sure. If you raise he might reraise with a king or draw, making you fold too often. The best play is to just call. Now, if you get heads up on the turn, you have to call all the way. And alas, you see a king or maybe the river comes an Ace and he bets and you fold to his busted draw or you call his Aces up.

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Why is this the right play? Once we put him on a K at the turn, wouldn't we fold and save 2BB? Calling down does not seem like a good option, especially if he's shown preflop aggression.

[mcozzy1]

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The turn is a 6. You have a terrified look on your face.

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I'm going to start playing with a motorcycle helmet. I didn't realize I was that easy to read.

[BWebb]

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This post is weak tight and too long.

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Thanks for the Cliff Notes version. I had no intention of reading all of that.

[mdeck]

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This post is weak tight and too long.

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Adding: "overly pretentious" to the description.

[soweak.]

It's been showing up a lot more consistently here these past few days.

This is supposed to make me a better player??

Thanks, but no thanks.

[TripleH68]

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Does this help?


-J

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Not really. I appreciate the time and effort, but what is the motivation behind your post?

The best advice I have received about AA is "if you never fold AA you will not be making a big mistake."