Low Limit OL Observations from cash game player

Mark1808 · #1 12-05-2005, 01:55 PM

I am a winning player at $5 $10 NL B&M games and in the past I have been an OL loser. I decided to try OL again, $50 NL, 4 tableing and have started doing well and have learned a lot and am seeking feedback.

First off, I am using Poker Tracker and have been unable to find useful benchmarks for the various variables. Any suggestions?

I have been playing very tight and aggressive OL, raising all premium hands (onless UTG) making continuation bets and in many cases betting out draws just as strongly as my made hands. I have found it is a much better EV play to raise marginal hands late with a couple of limpers and making a continuation bet then it is to limp and try to make a hand with a marginal holding.

Its easier to practice moves at low limit and it it is giving me confidence in uncovering profitable betting opportunities.

I am very suprised to see how tight the play is at $50 NL compared to what I remember. My cash games see many more callers and loose plays. Generally I find that bets mean what they say online and players are very reluctant to call with less than TPTK.

Another profitable play is betting out flops that are likely to missed the one or two players involved. Usually a face card with no draws is a great flop to bet out in an unraised pot. I have also had great sucess with a a raise in position with a draw when I see a weak bet made at the pot.

I always complete the small blind in an unraised pot because of pot odds but I am starting to think this is a leak in my game.

I feel its better to 4 table $50 then 1 table $200.

Any input or comments would be appreciated.

beavens · #2 12-05-2005, 01:58 PM

well i think you're going to find that most B&M places will be a lot looser than online.

where are you playing? i play 50nl at Party and people are loose as hell!

and are you saying you never raise UTG?

#3 12-05-2005, 02:10 PM

I've experienced the same as you, winning regularly in live games, and losing regularly on-line. I do fine in limit on-line, but in no limit I can't seem to win. The games online seem very tight to me as well. I've been reviewing my play, and I think I'm too impatient on-line. Whereas in B&M games I don't get bored waiting for good starting hands. I enjoy reading the other players when I'm not in the hand. I think this contributes greatly to my winning rate. On-line I can only read betting patterns, and I find it hard to stare at the computer screen endlessly while folding my weak hands. I'll be interested to read reply's to this thread.

4_2_it · #4 12-05-2005, 02:11 PM

NL $50 is much tighter than 1/2 live. Looks like you have a strategy that is working so keep at it. At the lower levels I am less likely to CB a dry flop because no body's folding.

Regarding stats, in online NL there are winning 18/5 and 45/20 players. Just depends on which style fits your game. The players at NL $200 aren't 4 times better than the ones at the 50's. Hopefully your goal is to work your way up..........

Mark1808 · #5 12-05-2005, 03:29 PM

[ QUOTE ]
well i think you're going to find that most B&M places will be a lot looser than online.

where are you playing? i play 50nl at Party and people are loose as hell!

and are you saying you never raise UTG?

[/ QUOTE ]

I have about 3,000 hand in $50 NL PP and it just seems you hardly ever have more than 2 players call a raise and usually its only one. I don't see a lot of players chase draws (generally). I don't have hard facts just a general feel that these games are no where near as loose as they were 2 years ago.

I do raise UTG, maybe 50 -50 and only play pairs or AK, AQ. I may stop playing low pairs because I am not really getting paid off when I flop a set.

Mark1808 · #6 12-05-2005, 03:33 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I've experienced the same as you, winning regularly in live games, and losing regularly on-line. I do fine in limit on-line, but in no limit I can't seem to win. The games online seem very tight to me as well. I've been reviewing my play, and I think I'm too impatient on-line. Whereas in B&M games I don't get bored waiting for good starting hands. I enjoy reading the other players when I'm not in the hand. I think this contributes greatly to my winning rate. On-line I can only read betting patterns, and I find it hard to stare at the computer screen endlessly while folding my weak hands. I'll be interested to read reply's to this thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

My play online has improved from tighter starting requirements, aggressive betting when I am in and respecting strength from other players.

Poker is a people game played with cards so I really prefer B&M games. However the ability to 4 table or more and get in so many hands per hour is awfully tempting. Even with a lower edge without commute time and maybe 10 times as many hands per hour it really is more effecient to play online. I need to take a close look at hourly rates to know for sure.

Mark1808 · #7 12-05-2005, 03:40 PM

[ QUOTE ]
NL $50 is much tighter than 1/2 live. Looks like you have a strategy that is working so keep at it. At the lower levels I am less likely to CB a dry flop because no body's folding.

Regarding stats, in online NL there are winning 18/5 and 45/20 players. Just depends on which style fits your game. The players at NL $200 aren't 4 times better than the ones at the 50's. Hopefully your goal is to work your way up..........

[/ QUOTE ]

Thank you, I obviously would like to work my way up just as I did in cash games. I believe bank roll and a winning rate over 25K hands would be neccessary to move up.

It amazes me the conclusions that are drawn in cash games over a relatively small sample size of hands. It might take 2 5 hour casino sessions to equal just one hour online!