109: AK flop play

[wuwei]

Thanks for the responses, folks. ChrisV, I hope recovering from surgery is going well.

One of my issues with this hand is that I've only played 2-3 dozen 109s. I don't have a great feel for the "general" opponent here when it's early and I haven't developed a read.

Preflop, the BB called a raise and a reraise. As Chris noted, the total bet was still pretty small and BB's range is significantly wider than my range of hands in that spot.

Next, he leads that flop. Those of you who think the BB doesn't lead a hand that beats you... well, that's why I often lead hands that beat you in that spot [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Leading gives us a chance to trap the guy in the middle and try to build a monster pot with our big hand. Hmm, but I'm not always playing myself here...

So... where was I. Even if the BB can't beat us at this point, we still have the other guy to act behind us. I'm really not that concerned about him, I'd be happy getting all my chips in the middle with him based on the donkish read. Regardless, his presence still makes me uncomfortable. Or perhaps I should appreciate his presence, as he may provide some overlay for the times we're behind the BB.

That's enough rambling, time for bed. I'll check back in tomorrow.

[tigerite]

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, it sucks... but folding here is wrong.

Pushing is what you do if you are good enough to recognize that folding is wrong, but not good enough to avoid making calling wrong by misplaying the rest of the hand.

So I would call here and do my best to play the rest of the hand really well.

Irieguy

[/ QUOTE ]

I would also call, personally.

[lacky]

no surprise from me, I'm calling here, and have no problem putting in the rest of my stack if need be. there's always another 109 starting.

Steve

[johnnybeef]

I call with the willingness to go broke on the turn.

[bigt439]

[ QUOTE ]
I call with the willingness to go broke on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I think I overestimated BB's skill level and the chance that a bad player in MP has us beat. This makes sense to go broke to the BB, but do you put another chip in the pot if MP calls behind us? I'm pretty sure we're folding if MP pushes correct?

[freemoney]

i gave u the best line, i dont need to write a book to say it.

[Karak567]

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, it sucks... but folding here is wrong.

Pushing is what you do if you are good enough to recognize that folding is wrong, but not good enough to avoid making calling wrong by misplaying the rest of the hand.

So I would call here and do my best to play the rest of the hand really well.

Irieguy

[/ QUOTE ]

Basically what you are trying to say is get down to the river and see a cheap showdown. If villain does not give you that option, you are OK but not happy with getting your money all in, right?

If it were just your original raise, I might put him on J10. But lets give this guy in the BB a little credit. You raise from EP and MP reraises...what could BB be calling this dangerous action with? Gotta be AK, AQ, or a pair. If he's got a pair JJ or lower, he's just gonna check fold. He doesn't have AA obviously. If he has QQ or 99, I think he slowplays. AK actually seems the most likely. AQ wouldn't surprise me (he might be afraid of checkraising in case he's up against a set) The other possibility would be KK (he doesn't want to just check fold, so he throws a bet out to see where he's at) I think a fold here is the safest bet.

Note that I don't play this limit and I don't know if someone would call with something like J10suited. If so, then I would probably put them on a strt. draw.

Not a 109 pro but this level does have its share of idiots. Keep in mind he was getting 2 to 1 with his call (2.5 if original raiser comes)and huge implied odds. J10 suited is only 1.5 to 1 against AK or AQ. 200 looks like a blocker bet to me. I think I raise him here and see what MP2 does. You will find where you stand real quick and I probably call an all in as well. BB would not lead out on this board with raise and re-raiser behind him, he would most def go for check raise if he has a set. Two pair he may be a little more aggressive to see where he stands but I am reasonably sure he goes for the check raise with either.

[Scuba Chuck]

wuwei, I've been thinking about this hand a lot. Not only do I see 2 pair playing it this way, but I also see a weaker ace and TJ playing it this way.

I can see why calling is more desirable, as we're likely only getting called by better hands if we push ...right? If we think a hand like AJ, AT, JT would call our push, then pushing seems good.

I'd be interested to hear how Lacky/Irie would play the turn and river, and feel free to provide any range of cards you would like...