25/50 vs. good players

[theBruiser500]

5 handed, LAG opens, good player calls, good player calls, they both have about 2.5k left after the calls. i have 4s 5s and call in the blinds 4 way. flop is 8s 9s Jh, check, pfr checks, good/tight player bets 750, good player calls, i go all in.

i think they will give me respect, but they are not wackos betting and calling with air

[radioheadfan]

Very draw heavy board. They should be good enough to figure out that you're pushing a draw here some fraction of the time. There's a lot money in there, and they could have decent pair + draw/combo draw with odds to call you. Not to mention they could have sets or two pair hands. Whether they give you credit for the nut straight is up in the air, but even if they do, they may think they have odds to call you with whatever they have. I see one or both villians calling with pair + flush draw, or pair + straight draw, in addition to sets and possibly top two pair. I think you're getting overpairs and TPTK type hands to lay down, but there's still a ton of crap they could call you with. If they call with pair + straight draw type hands you're not in terrible shape but if either one has something like JsTs obviously they're not mucking and you're screwed.

I'm not a big fan of this play, especially with that caller on the button.

[The_Bends]

On the plus side if they're good players they might note that the flat call of the raise didn't put you off you're CR and therefore figure you for a monster hand which could bump up your fold equity. That said I spose you wanted either both in on both to fold provided your flush draw was good.

All in all I'm not a big fan, most likely result is that either both call with one holding either a set or a higher flush draw which puts you in trouble or one folds and the other calls which I don't think gives you the pot odds. What I'm trying to say is that either you'll get two big hands that its virtually impossible to suck out on or you'll only get one biug hand which you can draw out on but arn't getting the odds to do so.

[kagame]

is this a metagame thing?

i sortof agree that this isnt the best board as it hits people s possible hands to well BUT perhaps you push sets really hard on coordinated draw heavy boards also to protect yourself or to avoid action killing turn cards?

then the all in makes sense on mulitple levels i think

[cwl]

during the hand all i remember thinking was that i was glad i checked so i could be letting results sway me a bit but i think you will just about never get them both to fold in this spot. much of the time it wont be a big deal and youll have a live flush draw and it wont really matter and occasionally you will be virtually dead. i think good player #1 doesnt bet 1/3 of his stack into that flop with a ton of hands he will fold and im not sure if there are any hands good player #2 can have here that would fold.

[creedofhubris]

[ QUOTE ]
5 handed, LAG opens, good player calls, good player calls, they both have about 2.5k left after the calls. i have 4s 5s and call in the blinds 4 way. flop is 8s 9s Jh, check, pfr checks, good/tight player bets 750, good player calls, i go all in.

i think they will give me respect, but they are not wackos betting and calling with air

[/ QUOTE ]

It makes sense if both of them call (without a bigger flush draw) or if both of them fold, and to set up later plays.

One caller = I think it's -EV

[drexah]

so basically if you are called you have 9 outs to a 5 high flush? imo the check-raise push on the flop looks a little sketchy, and if i had a hand like QJ or KJ or even a higher flush draw here i would probably call you, what was your stack after preflop?

[greywolf]

i like you play in general..im no big fan of it in this particular hand though, The biggest problem is that one of them could hold a higherflush draw and the other a made hand in which case you are dead.

[greywolf]

calling the checkraise/push with QJ or KJ would be really bad agaisnt any sane 25/50 NLTH player.

[-Skeme-]

How's the gf search coming?