Hand from last night #2 - Reverse implied odds?

[tpir90036]

5/10 game that has become 6-handed but is still juicy. Clown min-raises UTG (very wide range of hands ). Fairly solid player calls on the button and I defend my BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. Stack sizes all pretty close and not an issue here.

Flop: (3 players, $65) T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
I check, UTG checks (he missed), Button bets $50 and I check-raise to $150.

Button would try to pick up the pot with a lot of junk here...but I might as well have 72o. I am either taking the pot down right now or flailing badly on the turn.

As soon as I raised I hated it. Anyone just check-fold the flop? I feel like that is kind of weak for a short game where my hand is best a huge percentage of the time. But being OOP on that board makes it really easy to outplay me if someone was so inclined. Thankfully these people are not inclined...but someday I will be in game where they are.

Sorry if these are super boring. But I talked about them with my friend who is a smart guy and does OK in these games and I disagreed with everything he said. Your thoughts?

[JMa]

make a potsize raise on the flop. If called, im shutting down.

[scdavis0]

In a min-raised pot like that (basically limped) default play is just lead out with what is most likely the best hand.

I would nearly always lead this flop for fifty. I have the best hand an extremely high precentage of the time. Check folding this flop to this bet is folding the winner far more than is profitable. If you think check raising puts you in a bad spot if he calls, consider flat calling and leading a non spade for $100. Including jacks, nines and sixes.

This puts the same amount of money in the pot and it is very difficult to play against.

[mgsimpleton]

lead flop. life becomes easier.

[tpir90036]

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lead flop. life becomes easier.

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Duly noted. But an astute player could call with nothing and steal this away from me when half of the cards in the deck are scary on the turn. Am I too afraid of being outplayed? Being OOP sucks!!!

[xorbie]

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lead flop. life becomes easier.

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Duly noted. But an astute player could call with nothing and steal this away from me when half of the cards in the deck are scary on the turn. Am I too afraid of being outplayed? Being OOP sucks!!!

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Lead your draws too.

[tpir90036]

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lead flop. life becomes easier.

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Duly noted. But an astute player could call with nothing and steal this away from me when half of the cards in the deck are scary on the turn. Am I too afraid of being outplayed? Being OOP sucks!!!

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Lead your draws too.

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Of course. I lead with all of my draws in this game no matter how big the field is because 1) I can set my own drwaing price. 2) no one is raising me unless they have a monster. 3) when people *do* raise they usually raise so small that i don't care and actually like the pot sweetening since it encourages people to go to showdown drawing dead.

The common idea between my two hands today is that I am not leading at pots enough. My desire to play small pots and my terror of being OOP is leading to me playing bad poker. Thanks to all.

[JooWish622]

Now, I've always thought check-raising in NL to be bad OOP UNLESS a. you are against a habitual continuation better, in which case you can check-raise with a wide variety of hands, made and unmade, such as big hands or gutshots with an overcard. This play is made profitable by the unlikelihood of him having anything and the possible strength of your hand.

Now, this play goes down when the board is very draw heavy. If he doesn't have a made hand, he is now drawing to one and there are many scare cards that can get you blown off your made hand. Even if you check-raise here, it may not get him off his hand, which may be as little as K9. So, is check-raising here always a bad play? Is a Stop and Go a good play here?

My thought for a stop and go: if you bet, he MAY fold his AK or if he has a high spade, he may raise or call your bet. If you check, the money is going in anyway and you can call the bet. Then, bet the turn regardless of the card. If it is a spade, he releases his worthless AK or maybe even a red QQ. If it isn't a spade, he will less likely bluff you off the hand since you've shown a tricky/strong line.

It seems this line gets the money in when he has the worst of it and it minimizes the chance of you losing to a bluff. thoughts? do i stop and go too much? is check-folding the flop that terrible a line?

[Spladle Master]

I would check/call the flop and re-evaluate on the turn.