Foxwoods 20/40 BB TPWK

[W. Deranged]

So I hit up the Woods 20/40 last night. I firmly believe this post belongs in this forum (micros, maybe) considering the play was so much worse than Party 3/6 I can't even tell you. And I like you guys so I want to hear what you guys have to say.

Foxwoods 20/40 (10 handed)

I'm in the BB with J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

UTG+1 limper is a bit of a pre-flop and flop lag but probably the second-best player at the table (behind yours truly... no other 2+2ers anywhere to be seen) and plays pretty well on the big bet streets.

UTG + 2 is a very, very big fish. Giant calling station. Calls to the river with extremely marginal holdings. Only raises near nut hands. Doesn't ever raise pre-flop. Will willingly call multiple bets on the flop with weak/non-existent draws, single overcards, etc...

MP limper is a tight-weak bitch. He can maybe play a little, but has the horrible tendency of badly underplaying hands. Earlier flopped trip jacks and folded face up to a single river bet when an A hit, complaining about how the dealer "put up a two-outer."

LMP limper is new to the table.

The

Pre-flop: UTG +1, UTG +2, MP, and LMP limpers. SB completes. I say "let's play" in some clever fashion.

Flop: J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Deranged bets, UTG +1 calls, UTG + 2 calls, MP raises, LMP folds, SB folds, Deranged calls, UTG +1 calls, UTG +2 calls.

Turn: K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Deranged checks, UTG +1 checks, UTG +2 checks, MP bets, Deranged folds...

The obvious questions are:

1. What is the best line on the flop?
2. Does anyone get to the river here?

[brettbrettr]

I play it exactly the same.

[McGahee]

[ QUOTE ]
I play it exactly the same.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I don't see how else you can play it; I think this hand would be a lot more interesting if the flop raiser wasn't weak/tight. Without a read do you 3-bet the flop or C/R a harmless turn card?

[pauliewalnuts]

Even if he only has A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] here, with two players yet to act I think this is a fold. If it were heads up, I might call down if I thought he'd play a big flush draw this way. But you cant feel too good about your hand if UTG+1 or UTG+2 were to call here.

Edit: I think the flop play is fine.

[ThomasPHoolery]

[ QUOTE ]
I say "let's play" in some clever fashion.



[/ QUOTE ]

I'm really curious to know what the clever fashion was. I really think it effects the way I play the hand. After all, it could have huge implications on metagame considerations.

I think you play it correctly though.

[BigEndian]

I think I would have folded the flop when I bet it and it was raised. My preferred line with this many opponents and no real re-draws would be to check and see what happens with the action.

- Jim

[CrackerZack]

Me too.

Although I wouldn't have led out with a crap holding with little chance of thinning hte field. I'd have checked, if an EP bet, can it was called all around, I'd consider if I thought a 6 was gonna be good, which it probably would be, and consider peeling one. If the bet came from the button, I'd consider check-raising if it would knock out the early limpers. Betting out allow the limpers to call cheap and gives you no real clue where you are in the hand.

The 20 on the weekends there is just amazingly bad. Although this is true everywhere I've played on the east coast.

[W. Deranged]

Hey guys,

Thanks. The reasons I didn't like a check here had a lot to do with the nature of the table. With the aggro player on my right, I figured a bet had the best chance of thinning the field if the agg. raised, though the player two to my left (the fish) would likely call anything. I'd have liked a check a lot more if I had any idea about where a bet might come from (the agg. would be the most likely, but checking and letting him bet immediately after me does little for me either).

This may simply be a hand that doesn't really merit any amount of effort because it is really too weak, though that seems tight-weak.

[BigEndian]

I think your last sentiment is right on actually. With a field this big and the seats like you describe them, you can find better places to invest your chips. Plenty of overlay to try to force things by putting the squeeze play on the field (if they even recognize that there a raising threat behind them, or even care).

- Jim

[jstewsmole]

1. The best line here is check with the intention of either raising or folding.
If the bet comes from early position its an easy fold in this protected pot.
If it comes from the weak tight bitch its an easy fold.
If it comes from a lag that u think is just betting (like they do with anything) towards the end u reraise and isolate him especially if u think that will thin the field.
I think betting out here is possible spewing. You probably dont have the most equity in this hand, and when u get raised u have to call the raisers bet.
By checking u get the same thing accomplished and if u decide to go on with the hand and raise u have control of the hand going into the turn so u can bet out.
2. NO

I commend the seat change u made between these two hands [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]