Sometimes I have no clue how I played the hand

Peter · #1 04-04-2005, 05:22 AM

In the hands I play, I know whether I played the hand alright, reasonable, or pretty bad most of the time. Sometimes however, I have no clue whether I played it extremely bad or I played it like a real pro. Here's one where I don't know what to think of my play:

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Peter is CO with 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, MP calls, Peter calls, 1 fold, SB completes, BB checks.

With one or no limpers I often raise here. Should I raise with 2 limpers as well?

Flop: (5 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)

I figure I will bet this flop, if checked to, or I will raise.

SB bets, BB calls, UTG calls, MP raises, Peter calls, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls.

So it was already raised before me, I have no clue what to do. Perhaps calling was the worst option? I don't know.

Turn: (7.50 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Peter checks.

Might my hand be good here, should I have bet?

River: (7.50 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)

I planned to bet or raise this river.

SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP bets, Peter calls,

Guy to my right bet, I figure I will get more money going for overcalls if my hand is good. Without having much risk of getting reraised when behind.

SB raises, BB folds, UTG folds, MP 3-bets, Peter calls,

Ok, I'm scared now. Any chance I'm good here?

I appreciate any opinions.

Peter

NLSoldier · #2 04-04-2005, 05:49 AM

preflop is good

flop- i think you are right that calling is the worst option. At first i was leaning toward 3 bet, but now I think its a fold. You are not neccesarily ahead right now, and even if you are, you are almost definately not going to win without improvement (unless of course you 3 bet and manage to signifigantly narrow this field, which is unlikely). So assuming you need to improve to win, then you are drawing to 4 gutshot outs, one of which is likely dirty, and 2 set outs, both of which are likely dirty (because now any 4 makes a straight). So lets say you have an average of 4 outs, getting 10 to 2, and not likely to get lots of action with your 1 card straight if you hit it, I like a fold.

Turn-given your flop call, I don't think you gain much by betting this turn so you were correct to take the free card.

River-after MPs flop raise and turn check it looks like he has either a flush draw or a 6 (or medium overpair) that got scared by the ace. If he has the latter, then it doesnt make much sense for him to come out betting on this river. Therefore I think you should find a fold here. And should turbomuck when it comes back 3 bet.

[ QUOTE ]
I planned to bet or raise this river.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think raising this river would be pretty horrible no matter where the bet came from.

mperich · #3 04-04-2005, 05:59 AM

I probably fold this flop as well. Turn is good, I call the first bet but not the 3 cold maybe not even the check raise and an overcall.

-Mike

Mr. Graff · #4 04-04-2005, 09:28 AM

I hate that flop call. The pot is too small and your hand too vulnerable even if you are ahead at the moment. With this many players still in you won't stay ahead unless you catch a 4 or a 5 and those are not to the nuts. Given the flop action a flush draw also appears likely giving you even less outs.

Raising is marginally better, but folding is best IMO.

TMFS9 · #5 04-04-2005, 10:13 AM

Preflop limping behind is ok, if you think it is unlikely that you can fold everyone else out besides the limpers, but after limping with small pp's in large fields you're going to have to play it largely for set value or get out.

Peter · #6 04-04-2005, 12:05 PM

Many thanks all.
Having no clue about how I played the hand seems to only happen when I make a misstake in the beginning, which puts me in bad spots afterward.
I'm not sure yet why it should be an autofold after the 3bet on the river, but maybe that's results oriented thinking.

SB folded after I called the 3bet, 3better showed 37s but from the wrong suit, so I took it down.

Peter

NLSoldier · #7 04-04-2005, 08:26 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Many thanks all.
Having no clue about how I played the hand seems to only happen when I make a misstake in the beginning, which puts me in bad spots afterward.
I'm not sure yet why it should be an autofold after the 3bet on the river, but maybe that's results oriented thinking.

SB folded after I called the 3bet, 3better showed 37s but from the wrong suit, so I took it down.

Peter

[/ QUOTE ]

So you are saying he 3 bet the river with 1 pair of 3s? You must have had some sort of a read on him that he was this much of a donk?

Jeff W · #8 04-04-2005, 08:28 PM

Great analysis.

tac252 · #9 04-05-2005, 02:44 AM

I agree 100%

Tom

Peter · #10 04-05-2005, 08:42 AM

I think I knew I shouldn't be calling the river before I did call. That's probably why I got so confused when I did win the hand. Did I just play it badly like I thought I did, or did I play it brilliantly, because of some sort of read I had. I didn't feel I had any real read on this guy, so why did I call? Maybe because I found that the checkraise by the SB really meant nothing, if he really had a better hand than me, I figure he would have bet out on the river. This meant that the 3bet might not mean so much as it looked like it did.
But if I really had a read on this guy, shouldn't I have 3bet the flop? Calling is still pretty bad there.

Peter