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#11
08-09-2005, 11:38 PM
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Re: Questionable on every street
[ QUOTE ]
I don't really know if I like the raise or not. The 8's are totally live. Many people will not bet the river here with just open two pair b/c they figure not to get called by anything they beat (obviously). Also, if he is sensible, he's not calling a river raise here unless against a habitual bluffer (and even habitual bluffers prob don't attempt this here). That said, I think anyone with a clue is not betting this river without a full house...if he just has the two pair, why not check and hope to snag a bluff? Interesting spot, a lot depends on your opponent. Jeff [/ QUOTE ] Have you PLAYED on party? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] Many people make the lame bet on the river with nothing more than their board. Since he doesn't raise back, he's clearly beat, and he's calling out of spite/curiosity. This guy is either retarded (for betting the river with nothing more than his board) or REALLY retarded (for not raising with his boat). 
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#12
08-10-2005, 12:08 AM
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Re: Questionable on every street
[ QUOTE ]
In my opinion, I would have checked 4th. You've got a drawing hand, nothing else. By doing so, you could have seen whether or not the Q or the K would bet (helping you determine what they had). [/ QUOTE ] I like a check especially considering you're two cards from making a draw and two of your pair cards are out. Otherwise, well played. I agree with the raise on the river simply because I would not have played it as he did if I had the boat.
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#13
08-10-2005, 12:11 AM
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Re: Questionable on every street
I have a feeling many of the responses would be different if...
Seat 1: xx xx K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] xx___bets___craises Hero: A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___raises__cryingcalls,shakesfistinair
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#16
08-10-2005, 12:08 PM
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Re: Questionable on every street
[ QUOTE ]
since the other two kings are in the hero's hand, and there is no straight or flush potential on the villan's board, he's gonna need exactly one of the other two eights or hidden aces to have the hero beat. additionally, just about anyone will bluff on the river with two pair on board... the only reason i see not to raise is that there is no reason at all for the villan to call after being raised, except to snap off a bluff... i like the raise, esp against an opponent that'll call when your action tells him that he's beat. [/ QUOTE ] I'm fairly new to 7-stud, but as an exercise I've been trying to figure out what villian's hole cards were. Somebody let me know if you think my reasoning makes sense. He probably didn't start with a 3-straight, because if he did, then his calls on 4th and 5th street are pretty bad. But if he's a loose player he could play it this way, so I would say a hand like KQJ on 3rd is a remote possibility. If he started with any wired pair, then his check/call on 5th street doesn't make any sense. I don't think any player would play it like this, they would probably come out betting, or possibly go for a check/raise. So this means that on the river, there's almost no chance that he beats hero with two pair, aces and kings. If he had wired aces, his play on 4th would be pretty strange as well. So I think villian probably started with 3 spades on 3rd street. His call on 4th is still a bit loose, but now his check/calls on 5th and 6th make a lot more sense. So I think viliian just hit his 2-pair "by accident", then made a bad value bet on the river, and called hero's raise knowing that he was probably beat. If villian had re-raised the river I'd put him on a spade flush, not a boat or aces up. Whaddaya think?
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#17
08-10-2005, 12:19 PM
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Re: Questionable on every street
If his board is all he has, why would he value bet the river? He won't be called by less than kings up. The only value he has in betting is if he boated on the end or made some bigger two pair like aces up AND puts his opponent on a hand that can beat his board but won't bet if checked to. My guess is if he made 8's full and was raised on the end, he wouldn't reraise since his opponent's raise probably signifies he can beat a smaller full house.
Jeff
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#18
08-10-2005, 12:43 PM
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Re: Questionable on every street
For anyone who thinks he has a boat:
What do you think villian initially called with? xx 8 K... If he called with say A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] why do you find it unreasonable for him to bet his board at the end? Clearly if you think he has a boat he isn't rock solid.
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#20
08-10-2005, 01:10 PM
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Re: Questionable on every street
[ QUOTE ]
Obviously there are plenty of idiots out there though lol. [/ QUOTE ] My point is that in my experience the people who do make these kinds of bets are the same people who play junk. I'm just wondering what kind of hand you think he may have had initially. Do you think he started with an 8 or did he river it? And, either way, what did he start with because what I was trying to get at is if the villian started with 3 cards with little potential I would think that would make him more likely to simply bet his board.
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