Those Fishooks

Mroberts3 · #1 06-19-2005, 09:16 PM

I think I messed this up... I should have bet the turn because it didnt hurt me if I was behind already, and there could be hands I still beat that have outs to beat me. Also I should have folded river because I cant beat any reasonably hand that a fish (which he was by the way) would bet with. Is this analysis correct?

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
2 folds, Hero raises, 1 fold, CO calls, 3 folds.

Flop: (5.50 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets, CO calls.

Turn: (3.75 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets, Hero calls.

River: (5.75 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 7.75 BB

silkyslim · #2 06-19-2005, 09:21 PM

bet the turn, check/call the river if you think you are behind

LargeCents · #3 06-19-2005, 10:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I think I messed this up... I should have bet the turn because it didnt hurt me if I was behind already, and there could be hands I still beat that have outs to beat me. Also I should have folded river because I cant beat any reasonably hand that a fish (which he was by the way) would bet with. Is this analysis correct?

[/ QUOTE ]

IF you are going all the way, you might as well bet it all the way.

imported_Reaction · #4 06-20-2005, 12:30 AM

What hand(s) do you think CO is calling with PF?

aK13 · #5 06-20-2005, 12:40 AM

Ax, PPs, Kx, suited connectors, garbage....

Bet the turn again -- I think you can safely fold to a raise.

smcannon · #6 06-20-2005, 12:58 AM

Why not fold the turn?

Dave G. · #7 06-20-2005, 03:27 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Why not fold the turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

If we think we're behind to an A, we should be folding the flop. The turn didn't help any hands that aren't already beating us. In fact, the appearance of the second A makes it less likely that villain has one himself.

We should bet because we might still be ahead. If he is a bad player, there's a very wide range of hands he could have here. It's an easy fold to a raise.

If he calls, check/call the river (though this one could have been nicer). I've noticed a lot of otherwise passive players LOVE to bluff at the river (I seperate aggression by street in PV and a significant number of people have numbers like 0.65/0.74/3).

WSOP Bound · #8 06-20-2005, 02:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why not fold the turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

If we think we're behind to an A, we should be folding the flop. The turn didn't help any hands that aren't already beating us. In fact, the appearance of the second A makes it less likely that villain has one himself

We should bet because we might still be ahead. If he is a bad player, there's a very wide range of hands he could have here. It's an easy fold to a raise.

If he calls, check/call the river (though this one could have been nicer). I've noticed a lot of otherwise passive players LOVE to bluff at the river (I seperate aggression by street in PV and a significant number of people have numbers like 0.65/0.74/3).

[/ QUOTE ]

What hands are you expecting villian to have that we can beat here? Doesn't seem like a whole lot. I think that the only hand that you have beat here is a flush draw. Yes an A is less likely once the second one hits the board. With that said (if I recall correctly) of all possible starting hands 17% of them contain an A or K and only 5% contain two hearts. If you look at only reasonable starting hands the number of hands containing and A or K just go up higher.

On the flop I like the bet, you have to take a stab at this. On the turn I think I have to check/fold. I've got to believe that villian is holding either an A or K. With a read telling me that this player is capable of betting a pair of twos or a draw here when I show weakness then I call, but that's the only way.

Is this line that wrong? Seems like it might be one of those razor thin situations that don't really matter one way or another.

hbaromega · #9 06-20-2005, 03:38 AM

probably fold the turn, definitely fold the river.
you could also bet/fold the turn

Mroberts3 · #10 06-20-2005, 04:04 AM

well im glad not everyone agrees on what to do, at least that means it wasn't an obvious mistake by me. As for the results the villain had QJs in hearts so he had the flush draw and then hit his queen on the river. This is why I needed to bet the turn, cause there are a lot of hands that I still beat that he can call with. I personally think that I should have bet the turn, folded to a raise and then check/called the river. Thanks for the advice all.