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  #1  
Old 11-29-2005, 12:32 PM
MLG MLG is offline
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Default I Just Called to Say How Much I Care

Time for some more hand reading fun. This hand happened in the second level level of this sundays 700k on Stars.

UTG with 2130 opens for 90. He has done some weird things, including betting 700 into a 200 pot at one point. UTG+1 calls the 90 with 2535 behinf. He's pretty decent, but probably slightly too loose. He also likes to call flop raises and cr all-in on the turn (even if his hand isnt quite strong enough to merit it). I call with a couple of cards UTG+2 and 2015. I've been fairly active at the table so far, but haven't seen showdown too often. Fairly nondescript button comes along with 2565. He has overplayed a couple of hands, but not really in a bad manner. BB also tags along with 1990. I have no idea about him. Oh, you won't need all that info, but I'm just putting you in my head preflop (although I'm not letting you see my cards).

Anyway, flop comes Q53 all diamonds. UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, and I bet 240 into the 450 pot. Only UTG, the initial raiser calls. I find this check call odd. Turn is the 7s. UTG checks, I bet 730. UTG calls. River pairs the 30. UTG checks yet again. I push for 1045. Ranges for me and ranges for UTG to call with and fold with.
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  #2  
Old 11-29-2005, 12:42 PM
betgo betgo is offline
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Default Re: I Just Called to Say How Much I Care

What is your hand? Or are you bluffing and the cards don't matter? The play is loose enough this early that I wouldn't generally be going allin with nothing.
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  #3  
Old 11-29-2005, 12:45 PM
MLG MLG is offline
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Default Re: I Just Called to Say How Much I Care

The point is for you to decide on the range of hands that I could push with and some frequency, and then decide what range of hands UTG should be calling me with. I didn't forget to include my hand.
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  #4  
Old 11-29-2005, 01:00 PM
Toro Toro is offline
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Default Re: I Just Called to Say How Much I Care

With villian checking the river, I can't put him on a flush or full house. Almost everyone who might have been slow playing out of postion would now bet out.

So I think he has TPTK with a flush draw and that's what you got to beat. So I think you can bet with any hand that beats that and he just might feel the pot is too big to fold and might pay you off.
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  #5  
Old 11-29-2005, 01:17 PM
Apathy Apathy is offline
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Default Re: I Just Called to Say How Much I Care

[ QUOTE ]
The point is for you to decide on the range of hands that I could push with and some frequency, and then decide what range of hands UTG should be calling me with. I didn't forget to include my hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

You could have A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]Q, a flush, or a set (4 of a kind on river as well).

he should call with anything that beats medium sized flush. I don't know what the opponent has except to say that they almost certaintly played it badly.
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  #6  
Old 11-29-2005, 01:23 PM
jcm4ccc jcm4ccc is offline
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Default Re: I Just Called to Say How Much I Care

I think you have a speculative hand that you were hoping to flop something big and trap UTG and UTG+1, given that you had position on them and that they played in such a way that they would pay off big. I don't think you would want to try to bluff these guys off a pot, because they are a bit unpredictable (UTG) or a bit of a calling station (UTG+1).

So 22-99, suited connectors, probably two Broadways that have some potential is your range. Something that you might not normally call for a raise in this position.

You like the flop, and you are not trying to take down the pot right now, as your bet is not that strong. However, your bet does give incorrect odds for someone to call with the flush draw. So I don't think you are working on the flush draw (or else you are giving yourself a mathematically incorrect bet if someone calls you).

I also don't think you have top pair (or you would have bet stronger). I don't think you have two pair, since the board isn't really conducive to that. No straight or straight draw either. So the only thing I can come up with is a set.

The turn doesn't change my mind. The river pairs the 3, which makes me think you have a set of 5s. Possibly the quad 3s.

As for UTG, he will call your river push with any flush or straight. He may fold top pair, as the 3 pairing on the board might scare him a bit. Then again, he might put you on a bluff and call.

His calls are strange and seem to be either trapping or chasing. One hand that makes sense is the nut flush, which he is obviously slowplaying. A lower flush does not make sense, because he would want to raise the flop in order to protect against someone drawing out with the A of diamonds.

A straight is possible, but even stranger (he would have raised UTG with 46o). So I'm guessing the nut flush if he calls you, and a draw that he was chasing (A of diamonds and another card) if he folds.
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  #7  
Old 11-29-2005, 01:30 PM
adanthar adanthar is offline
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Default Re: I Just Called to Say How Much I Care

I've gotta run so I'll be brief.

Your range on the flop: a naked Ad, 64s (not diamonds), Ad + a pair, set, Q + a decent diamond (Ad-KdQx, QxJd), possibly a queen/no diamond or 53 but I doubt those

His range: big diamond, set, queen, overpair with no diamond

None of those change at all by the river, except that I think your turn bet is a value bet rather than a bluff so the naked ace is probably out.

The worst hand you can have with that river push is probably AQ or an occasional bluff. The problem is that the second worst is 64. Given that, I think he can call with any flush, but has to fold the queens (on the turn, because he should know a push is probably coming on the river after that bet/remaining stack sizes, but he doesn't because he's an idiot.) If he has AA...I dunno, he's stupid but gave himself odds good enough to snap some bluffs off.
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  #8  
Old 11-29-2005, 01:33 PM
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Default Re: I Just Called to Say How Much I Care

think your pushing anything (air?) just from villains actions. Villain looks to be on a flush draw or a pocket pair with a flush draw. At the river, villain puts you on similar hand. Based on the way you say he has played to this point and the fact that you state you have been "fairly active", villain calls with minimum TPTK, if he has been playing an under pair with a diamond (which looks possible), then he is a total donk to make this river call. Depending on your "fairly active" previous plays, villain may have even slow played the river also, knowing you would bet out.
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  #9  
Old 11-29-2005, 01:34 PM
citanul citanul is offline
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Default Re: I Just Called to Say How Much I Care

for your range, i'd say AdQ, a set (maybe even quads now), a flush, AdAx, KdKx, and the far less likely KdQx. even though you're you, i don't want to allow you to have 53 in this spot.

I don't think you can have other pairs because i don't think you'd push the river i you somehow got there with TT-88 or whatnot. I don't give you much % bluffihood here because you bet in to a LOT of players on the flop. it's a scary board and all but i don't think you think you can take it down on the flop that often. also, you're going to get the wonderful checkraise all-in on the flop by basically any made flush and most Ad if they're out there, so either you know this and are courting it both for "information's" sake and to get more money in the pot when you're not in this spot, or i'm missing something. other hands that you could have had i just don't think you could possibly bet on the river, since you've got to be thinking he's calling by then, i think.

your opponent, well, whatever he has he played it horribly, unless he knew you so well that he was getting you to 3 barrel him with the worst hand. i don't think that's likely.

with the odds i want to put on your range, i'd guess that the calling hands he has to have here on the end is: any full house, any flush probably Jd high or better? maybe some slightly smaller flushes. and quads, yeah, quads would be good.

i can't see your opponent playing any of those hands in the way this hand went down and it having been a good way of playing it though, and like i said, i can't see him playing anything in this way and it being well played. i want to say he's got something like AdQx himself here very often.

c
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  #10  
Old 11-29-2005, 02:14 PM
Punker Punker is offline
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Default Re: I Just Called to Say How Much I Care

Your range: strong - you are not drawing. You note that he likes to checkraise all in on the turn, so you're probably not sitting there with a dry ace opening the action for him on the turn to do this and leave you to call your stack with nothing and one to come. I'm thinking you must have a queen here at the bare minimum, but I suspect even stronger.

His range: If he can't beat KQ he should certainly fold. It seems very unlikely given the way the hand played that he has an overpair. Given how the hand played, my only guess is that he flopped the nut/nearnut flush and is trapping you. I expect he would have to call with it, but I think its only about 50-50 as to whether it's good or not.
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