JJ with overcard / paired board

[HouseCalls]

PokerStars 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: HouseCalls is UTG+2 with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">HouseCalls raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, MP3 calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, SB calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (11 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">HouseCalls bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 raises</font>, SB folds, UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, HouseCalls ??

[tyler_cracker]

HouseCalls calls (heh). Re-evaluate on the turn, but probably check/fold.

Call, but I'm probably checking the turn UI. There are a lot of hands we can't beat and unless UTG is uber-donk, he has to have something. Slow down &amp; see what happens. If it goes c,c,b,UTG CALL, then I fold.

[Eeegah]

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HouseCalls calls (heh). Re-evaluate on the turn, but probably check/fold.

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I don't like this; we aren't getting odds to draw to a 2-outer, which is what you're advocating here.

Call, don't bet out on the flop and then fold when it is one more et to you in a huge pot getting 16 to 1 this automatic, the MP3 could be raising with a smaller PP or someother crazy holding. Even if you are behind to a queen or an 8 you are 22 to 1 to catch your jack, so the implied odds on a draw are very good, seeing that you will collect more than three BB's if you do catch your boat. All together this is automatic. As ED says don't fold strong hands in big pots, on the flop for one bet.

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HouseCalls calls (heh). Re-evaluate on the turn, but probably check/fold.

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I don't like this; we aren't getting odds to draw to a 2-outer, which is what you're advocating here.

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So, do you advocate c/c, c/f, or b/f on this flop? Why?

[tyler_cracker]

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HouseCalls calls (heh). Re-evaluate on the turn, but probably check/fold.

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I don't like this; we aren't getting odds to draw to a 2-outer, which is what you're advocating here.

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I don't like it either, but i dislike it less than 3-betting or folding for one more back to us in a good-sized pot when we raised preflop and lead the flop.

calling &gt; folding &gt; raising.

Besides, we have a 2-gap 1-card backdoor draw to a non-nut straight. That's got to be worth, like, .005 additional outs!?