Skill in Limit vs NL

[GoodTiMes]

I just don't understand people who play limit hold'em. It's a game where there is no creativity. It is so mechanical and robotic. A crappy player can two out me on the river over and over and I can't do anything about it. NL is a much more profitable game. My NL rate is atleast 5x higher than my limit rate and much less volatile. In NL I've never had a losing span of 4 days online. In limit I could probably have a losing month.

[ACPlayer]

[ QUOTE ]
I just don't understand people who play limit hold'em. It's a game where there is no creativity. It is so mechanical and robotic. A crappy player can two out me on the river over and over and I can't do anything about it.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are just soooooo wrong.

Good limit players live for guys who are two outing them on the river. We welcome them, send them fruit plates and stroke their superior skills.

Limit is much harder because the plays are far less automatic and you are faced with non-automatic decisions all the time. That said the decisions in (real not the mini NL that is so popular) are more critical because they are for more money.

The baby NL take less skill and can be played with a basic formula; however the opponents are making such big mistakes that the game can be very profitable.

[SpeakEasy]

[ QUOTE ]
I've always thought that NL takes more skill, since there are more options in it with different bet sizes. Anyone care to elaborate?

[/ QUOTE ]

I used to play about equal amounts of NL and limit. For the last year, I have focused almost exclusively on NL, live and on-line cash games and tournaments. (I'll play limit on-line about once a month for a bit, just to make sure I can still play that game.) The NL games have been good to me. My thoughts:

NL takes more patience. I generally fold more in NL.

NL takes more aggression. I play more aggressively when I'm in a hand than in limit. I'm rarely in a situation where I call, unless my opponent is betting too small (which is rare) and thus makes calling the correct action.

I still constantly calculate pot odds in NL, both in the hands I am involved in, and when I fold and am just observing. I want to find out who will make bad calls with incorrect pot odds, for purposes of isolation in future hands, for example.

NL provides much more information about your opponents' hands, primarily in the form of bet sizes and thinking and reaction times. There is also other info in live NL games that is just not there in limit. When you play a lot of NL, you naturally get better at reading players and their hands because of the greater amount of information available. This increases your skill level. To get good at NL, it demands that you become skilled at accurately reading this additional information that is not available in limit. So, as a result, I believe NL takes more overall skill. Its important to have the "math" part down cold in NL and limit, and the "feel" part requires more skill in NL.

A final thought is that there aren't many that would accuse the 2+2 authors of being as proficient at the "feel" part as the "math" part of the game. That being said, the math part alone is probably more demanding in limit.

Best way to answer your own question is try both, and then decide for yourself. If you're good at the "feel" part of the game, then NL would be your flavor.

[Aaron51_lz]

The discussion of NL vs Limit skill levels is discussed in poker essays 1. In my opinion poker essays 1-3 should be read by anyone who plays poker seriously and I believe Mason gives a very good arguement for why he believes limit is more difficult than no-limit. Do yourself a favor and read them all.

[GoodTiMes]

If you're a skilled poker player, your rate will be higher and your volatility will be less in NL. I win 6/7 days I play NL and I still make a lot of costly errors.

[bohemian]

I'm surprised nobody mentioned PL.