10/20 KTs

jason_t · #1 12-04-2005, 02:38 AM

This villain is not known to me.

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (9 max, 9 handed) pokerhand.org hand converter

Preflop: I am BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
4 folds, CO raises, 1 fold, SB calls, I call.

Flop: (6 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, I check, CO bets, SB calls, I raise, CO 3-bets, SB folds, I call.

Turn: (6.50 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, I check, CO bets, SB folds, I raise

bakku · #2 12-04-2005, 03:02 AM

hey jason,

i don't like it. getting 2 outers to fold = bad, getting called down = bad, getting 3-bet = bad.

blumpkin22 · #3 12-04-2005, 04:33 AM

bakku,

can you explain "getting called down = bad"?

thanks,
blumpkin

CardSharpCook · #4 12-04-2005, 04:40 AM

The problem is that we are pretty convincingly representing the Q. It allows a lot of hands that only have 2-3 outs to go away quietly. However, it also shuts up a lot of Qs. If I have QT here, I go into call down mode. Same with AK/KJ. OK, now what happens when I hit my spade on the river. I bet and he calls with QT. That's not nearly as good as check/rzing his azz. So this is a risk/reward situation. The risk of getting 3bet when you have to call, vs the reward of shutting out 2-3 outers. It also has the cost of killing a lot of hands that might pay off a flush river.

bakku · #5 12-04-2005, 04:47 AM

[ QUOTE ]
bakku,

can you explain "getting called down = bad"?

thanks,
blumpkin

[/ QUOTE ]

i think you're losing way too often when you get called down

TStoneMBD · #6 12-04-2005, 10:55 PM

id just call the turn. youre winning 2 bets when you river your 11ish outter by calling. by checkraising you only win 1. not only that but i think his hand range against you is pretty significant and hell be folding alot of hands to your turn checkraise that dont do you any/much good folding.

chief444 · #7 12-05-2005, 12:02 AM

Agreed. I'd say JJ or worse is folding here most of the time, AA/AK is calling down, and anything better is 3-betting the turn which really sucks. I don't mind the flop c/r. But I c/c the turn.

Klepton · #8 12-05-2005, 07:28 AM

4-bet, lead turn with your 15 outer

ResidentParanoid · #9 12-05-2005, 11:33 AM

I think it is better to bet out on the turn and see what happens, obviously calling if raised. If he's a LAG, he could be spewing with something random. If he's a TAG, he may be firing with a smaller pair, or a worse draw. I don't like the turn check-raise.

Jeffage · #10 12-05-2005, 12:02 PM

I would stop-go the turn here rather than checkraise it. If co was making a free card play you punish him and if SB was slowplaying a queen, you find out cheaper. Also, cutoff will prob call down with something like 10-10.

Jeff