AA...what to do on the turn??

[TiK]

This hand occurred on my first orbit at the table...so no reads...

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, Hero raises, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button calls, SB folds, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls.

Flop: (12.50 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(6 players)</font>
BB bets, UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls, Hero raises, Button folds, BB calls, UTG+2 calls.

Turn: (9.25 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
BB bets, UTG+2 raises, Hero...

[MoreWineII]

Crying call. Smells like a flush to me, though.

[Mike Gallo]

Hero...

...should not fold. [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

Even though you could be drawing dead, you still should take the hand to showdown in a pot that large against unknown opponents. If I had the Ace of trump I would raise,however with no suits I would tend to call.

Your ahead of A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] or any other one pair hands. You can improve to beat two pair hands. Your drawing dead to set.

Without any prior knowledge of the players, I want to get the hand to a showdown. I cannot fold Aces with the pot that big against unknown players.

Against opponents whose betting patterns I understand,I feel much more comfortable folding on the turn.

Now the newer posters and newer players can understand what makes poker so difficult. NiK did not have an answer for a critical part of the equation we call a poker hand; knowledge of his players betting patterns.

Anyone care to comment ?

[Fianchetto]

Unless you know UTG+2 to be a tricky player, I think you are looking at a made hand, probably a straight or flush.

So it looks like you are getting about 12:2 --&gt; 6:1 on your turn call, but if you want to go to show down it's AT LEAST 3BB so now you're looking at more like 4:1, but it could cost you more if the turn gets reraised, reducing your odds further.

If I was holding A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], I stick around.

In your case though if somebody has the straight or flush, you are drawing dead. If someone has a set, you've got 2 outs, and incorrect odds to draw.

The only "good scenario" is if somebody is getting frisky with A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], or they have two pair, you can catch up.

All in all, I think this is a fold.

[coyote]

[ QUOTE ]
Your ahead of A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] or any other one pair hands. You can improve to beat two pair hands. Your drawing dead to set.

Anyone care to comment ?

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry Mike, what'd I miss? I don't understand why he's drawing dead to a set....

Won't an A give him top set?

[gamblore99]

It looks very much like your beat, but the pot is pretty big, u still got a shot. Id hang around and see. + if your opponent is bluffing ull get a good read on opponent

[Mike Gallo]

Sorry Mike, what'd I miss? I don't understand why he's drawing dead to a set....
I meant to write straight...thanks too late to edit. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[TiK]

Thanks for all of your replies. I appreciate the commentary. For me, this hand would have been a lot different had I the A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. I would absolutely have called, but alas, I did not. I especially did not like the fact that there was a bet and a raise in front of me after I raised the flop. Thus, I was fairly certain that I was beat...also, I felt that at least one if not both bettors on the turn had a heart, which even more so lessens the number of my clean outs. So, I mucked my hand. Thanks again for all of your responses.

-Tik

P.S. Results:

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, Hero raises, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button calls, SB folds, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls.

Flop: (12.50 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(6 players)</font>
BB bets, UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls, Hero raises, Button folds, BB calls, UTG+2 calls.

Turn: (9.25 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
BB bets, UTG+2 raises, Hero folds, BB calls.

River: (13.25 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG+2 checks.

Final Pot: 13.25 BB

Results in white below: <font color="white">
BB shows Kh 2c (one pair, kings).
UTG+2 shows 8c 7c (two pair, eights and sevens).
Outcome: UTG+2 wins 13.25 BB. </font>

[StellarWind]

Fold. This pot is not that large in comparison to the likely cost of a showdown. We are not last to act on the turn and that is a very serious problem.

The turn card makes a flush, a straight, two pair for 87 connectors, and a set for the natural UTG limper 88.

One of my basic rules is to take it very seriously when two people say they have me beat. Not only is it a parlay to play for two people to be bluffing, but they are less likely to screw around when they have each other to consider and not just me.

I can't imagine why UTG+2 would raise the turn in front of me without a good hand. BB has just bet through him into the PFR--twice.

One poster implied he would stay in the hand to get a read on UTG+2. Not a good reason. The odds are heavy you'll get to see his hand for free.

[gamblore99]

[ QUOTE ]

One poster implied he would stay in the hand to get a read on UTG+2. Not a good reason. The odds are heavy you'll get to see his hand for free.

[/ QUOTE ]

i said that. your absolutely right