AA 3rd hand into tournament. How would YOU play it?

MrMoo · #1 08-23-2005, 10:51 AM

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t15 (10 handed) converter

MP2 (t1500)
MP3 (t1575)
CO (t3000)
Button (t1470)
SB (t1425)
BB (t1500)
UTG (t1530)
UTG+1 (t1500)
Hero (t1500)
MP1 (t1500)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls t15, 1 fold, Hero raises to t50, 3 folds, CO calls t50, 1 fold, SB calls t40, 1 fold, UTG folds.

Flop: (t177.50) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets t150, CO folds, SB calls t150.

Turn: (t477.50) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets t250, Hero raises to t750, SB calls t500.

River: (t1977.50) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB is all-in [475] , Hero ???

How would you play it and why?

zoobird · #2 08-23-2005, 11:10 AM

My thinking on this may be a bit skewed because I'm a relatively new player and have been playing in freeroll tournaments only so far, but here's my thinking at each stage:

Pre-flop: With pocket aces I'm usually just calling this early in the tournament. Lots of fish haven't been eliminated, and slowplaying seems to work very well. I'm willing to risk someone getting lucky with a drawing hand in return for the chance of taking someone's whole stack.

Flop: I'm worried about those 2 6's. Someone could easily have 76, 65, A6 or even K6 (in the freerolls anyway). The only hands that you have beat that I think would make sense for him are something like AQ, KQ, QJ or QT (from a loose player - possible since you probably have no reads yet).

Turn: Not sure I can read much into his bet since it could just be a probe bet, but his call makes me think its even more likely he's got 3 6's...or even made a full house with the 5.

River: Another card that could have made a full house for him. I've got to think his most likely holdings are AQ, 76, or 65. That said, I think you're committed to the pot and need to call.

sekrah · #3 08-23-2005, 11:11 AM

I call where you are at here.. A-Q, K-Q very likely and you'll probably see it more often than the flush draw or a 6.

Only thing I'd do differently is probably bet slightly more, 175-200 on the flop, then push all in on the turn after his raise.. If he has a 6 or flopped a set, so be it, but he'll have A-Q or K-Q here more often than not.

sekrah · #4 08-23-2005, 11:12 AM

[ QUOTE ]
My thinking on this may be a bit skewed because I'm a relatively new player and have been playing in freeroll tournaments only so far, but here's my thinking at each stage:

Pre-flop: With pocket aces I'm usually just calling this early in the tournament. Lots of fish haven't been eliminated, and slowplaying seems to work very well. I'm willing to risk someone getting lucky with a drawing hand in return for the chance of taking someone's whole stack.

Flop: I'm worried about those 2 6's. Someone could easily have 76, 65, A6 or even K6 (in the freerolls anyway). The only hands that you have beat that I think would make sense for him are something like AQ, KQ, QJ or QT (from a loose player - possible since you probably have no reads yet).

Turn: Not sure I can read much into his bet since it could just be a probe bet, but his call makes me think its even more likely he's got 3 6's...or even made a full house with the 5.

River: Another card that could have made a full house for him. I've got to think his most likely holdings are AQ, 76, or 65. That said, I think you're committed to the pot and need to call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Very bad advice here.. OP, do not let it enter your mind.

zoobird · #5 08-23-2005, 11:13 AM

Hey - I gave fair warning in my first sentence. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

If you could comment on which specific parts are especially bad, I'd definitely appreciate the chance to improve my game.

yvesaint · #6 08-23-2005, 11:21 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Hey - I gave fair warning in my first sentence. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

If you could comment on which specific parts are especially bad, I'd definitely appreciate the chance to improve my game.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do not limp Aces, especially during the first few levels of a tournament.

sekrah · #7 08-23-2005, 11:27 AM

Only limp in with Aces when you are UTG at a table filled with LAG's (Loose-Aggressive) who've been raising alot of pots preflop.

Raising is exactly the reason you eliminate hands like 5-6, 6-7, 6-8, 6-anything.

They called 3.5 BB preflop. I might have raise a little more than 50 actually.. In the early stages people are more likely to make liberal calls.. and already with one limper, I probably make it 75 to go (5 BB).

I wouldn't worry about those sixes.. Your opponent calling that bet on the flop certaintly tells me he has something.. The likely hood of it being a 6 is far lower than the Queen. A-Q, K-Q, Q-J are very realistic possibilities this early in a tournament that a weak or loose player might be holding. You can't run scared everytime the board pairs or you won't get far.

The fact that he led out on the turn, tells me that he doesn't have a 6 or a set. The bet on the turn tells me he has the queen.

The only other possibility, if it's a very loose player, who likes to steal pots, is two random hearts, maybe A-K or A-J hearts and he thinks you're bluffing, or he's setting up a bluff. If he's still holding a 6 or a set of queens (very unlikely) or if he made a set of 5s on the turn, its very unlikely he's betting into you here. He would more than likely check raise or check-call, then bet the river.

This is why you MUST, push all in on the turn. The simple 500 raise won't get it done. Push him all in and make him call of his stack with either the heart draw, or the A-Q, K-Q, Q-J.

Don't let him get to the river without being all in. Him slowplaying Kings or something is also another possibility at this level.

ZBTHorton · #8 08-23-2005, 11:37 AM

[ QUOTE ]
My thinking on this may be a bit skewed because I'm a relatively new player and have been playing in freeroll tournaments only so far, but here's my thinking at each stage:

Pre-flop: With pocket aces I'm usually just calling this early in the tournament. Lots of fish haven't been eliminated, and slowplaying seems to work very well. I'm willing to risk someone getting lucky with a drawing hand in return for the chance of taking someone's whole stack.

Your reasoning is completely off. Early in tournaments you have tons of morons who will call with much less holdings, and be way more likely to chase draws. Slowplaying - bad.

Flop: I'm worried about those 2 6's. Someone could easily have 76, 65, A6 or even K6 (in the freerolls anyway). The only hands that you have beat that I think would make sense for him are something like AQ, KQ, QJ or QT (from a loose player - possible since you probably have no reads yet).

Turn: Not sure I can read much into his bet since it could just be a probe bet, but his call makes me think its even more likely he's got 3 6's...or even made a full house with the 5.

The range your putting him on is way to big.

River: Another card that could have made a full house for him. I've got to think his most likely holdings are AQ, 76, or 65. That said, I think you're committed to the pot and need to call.

He is pot committed. And I bet he wins the pot here about 60% of the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

zoobird · #9 08-23-2005, 11:37 AM

For arguments sake, let's say the previous two hands were an all-in showdown where the winner pushed with Q6 preflop, and another preflop push that nobody called from another player...so we know we have one maniac and possibly a 2nd one. Assuming both of those players are yet to act, it would still be bad idea to limp w/aces in this situation?

ZBTHorton · #10 08-23-2005, 11:38 AM

If they called all-ins or pushed with Q6..that's even more reason to raise. Do you see why?