does clutch exist?

[EMcWilliams]

While I am no psychologist or biologist, I think I clutch does exist, and probably is endorphin and adrendline based. Some players release it when it counts (Jeter), while others lack it when it counts (A-rod)

Im a college bball player, and there is one more thing you havent touched on... it kinda doesnt exist in baseball as much, but in basketball at least:

The clutch players on my team (I'd like to think me, but at least one other as well) want the ball when the clock runs down... I feel my adrenaline pumping, and I get all hyped up... my puny little d2 crowd gets into it... and I feel I play at a heightened level.

Some players on my team, however badly they want the ball, react badly to these end of game situations... they get subconsciously nervous or something, it's weird. On the sideline, I've actually noticed some of them shaking.

So does clutch exist? I'd rather just think of it as executing when it counts, but I think it's mostly an adrenaline thing, and how you react to it.

[andyfox]

Well then Jeter must be doing it only when he's in the field, because at the plate he's not been a great clutch hitter. And I'm a big fan of the guy.

Maybe brains has something to do with it too. Anecdotal evidence: In the 9th inning of game 5 against the Angels, do or die for the Yankees, Jeter led off. He took strike one, knowing that, down by two runs, the Yankees needed him to get on base. Down 0-1, he knew he'd be getting the curve ball from F. Rodriguez, which he throws 99% of the time when ahead in the count. And he laced one that hung up into left field.

A-rod's now up. He takes ball one low. He doesn't know what's coming now. If he takes the next pitch, he can pretty much know what the third pitch will be: 2-0 he's going to get a fastball; 1-1 he's going to get the curve. Instead, he lunges a bit at a low curve, and pulls it right to the third baseman and it's a season-killing double play.

Just a thought . . . Then again, Jeter was pumped up coming off the field after the bottom of the 8th, knowing he and A-Rod were batting. He exhorted Alex with a "let's go" and he had that "look" in his eyes. Whereas Alex looked tight. Perhaps Jeter noticed it.

Then again, perhaps it was just luck that Jeter got a fat pitch and Alex didn't.

[UCF THAYER]

When the count is 0-2 against Albert Pujols, he is a .194/.216/.380 hitter. Gosh, he's horrible! I would never want him on my team when the game is on the line, i mean, what if the count gets to 0-2? We'd be screwed.

[UCF THAYER]

I have said before that i think clutch exists, but only in a certain way :

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I think clutch exists. BUT ONLY in this context:

Someone who is clutch is someone who does not let the pressure get to him, a player who under the most intense pressure would be able to hit just as well as if they were playing in an empty stadium. An unclutch player would be someone who lets the pressure get to them and make mistakes and/or perform worse.

The notion that a player bats better when he is in a pressure situation is absurd, for if he could do better in pressure situations then he is doing worse than his ultimate ability in 90% of his at bats. I would rather have a player who performs to his best ability in 90% of his at bats opposed to 10% no matter how important those 10% are.

When i think of a clutch player, i think not of someone who performs better than he normally would, but someone who can cope better with the pressure than your average player.


P.S. I'm a yankee fan, and the notion that Jeter is is ridiculous. There is lots of statistical evidence that shows he is very much anything but "clutch". The reason it seems like he is so clutch is because he gets so many opportunities in clutch situations, because of his team. Fans remember the times you come through more than the times you fail, so naturally anyone who gets lots of "clutch" plate appearances will appear to be very clutch.

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[BadBoyBenny]

No one can perform to their full ability all the time. Doing it at the right time is what makes someone clutch. It's not like Tiger is slacking if he misses a 12 foot putt on Thursday.

[BadBoyBenny]

I'm not so sure about Bob...

Link

[jstnrgrs]

I haven't read the thread yet, but I'm sure many have already said that clutch does not exist, that it is just statistical variation (these people probably gave little to no explaination as to why they believe this).

I just want to point out that athletes are not roulette wheels with no memory, or knowledge of the situation. Athletes know what the situation is, and that knowledge may effect them psychologically. Clutch may exist.

[Jim Kuhn]

If someone does not think 'clutch' exists they must not have played sports. Some people get nervous and 'choke' while other 'bear down' and produce extra results.

Thank you,

Jim Kuhn
Catfish4u
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[pryor15]

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Alex Rodriguez is a career .330/ .395/ .583 hitter in the postseason.

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wrong.

you aren't including his 2005 debacle.

oh, and take out those seatle numbers and it gets ugly in a hurry

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Is there any reason those don't count?

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b/c that's how you view statistics over the course of a career.

they were a long time ago, and he wasn't under nearly as much pressure to perform, since he wasn't a perennial mvp candidate and the highest paid player in history.

sure they count, but i certainly think it's important when career stats are heavily affected by numbers that are either a) very recent, or b) very old. (or at least as old as they can be, considering)

now if all the "bad" numbers were from seattle, that would be something much different.