Disturbing e-mail from partypoker

[bobbyi]

[ QUOTE ]
I got the same email. I requested clarification. They said that 'holdem inspector' (a glorified odds calculator) was the culprit and that it is now not allowed.

[/ QUOTE ]
Does this mean that people who use PokerOffice are getting the same email? Anyone gotten it for using that? It does odds calculations too.

[Dusseldorf]

This is from the pokertracker forum. http://www.pokertracker.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6313

[ QUOTE ]
I just had someone else email me that had Poker Prophesy loaded and he got the same message. So he deleted PT and PP and then got an email back from Party saying PT was ok. I asked him to send me that email, I'll post it here if he does.
_________________
Pat
www.pokertracker.com

[/ QUOTE ]


Hope it is OK to quote across forums as such. Hope it is okay to use PT also.

Also I sure hope I can find a way to get PE back too. You know, all you PE-haters, you ought to understand these tools reduce our effective rake by speeding up the time it takes to clean a fishy.

[TomR]

[ QUOTE ]
If Party removes these accounts the guys at PokerStars will be having a huge party of their own.

[/ QUOTE ]

[SamIAm]

Wow. Yours lists 3 apps. I asked about Pokertracker, GT+, and PokerEdge. My response lists JUST pokerEdge.

-Sam

[ QUOTE ]
Dear Sam,

PartyPoker strictly prohibits usage of programs that:

1) Automate playing of the hand in any way
2) Participate in collusion or any other cheating methods
3) Use any information which may provide you with an unfair advantage through cheating

We detect and block programs that fall in any of the above categories. Usage of such programs may result in poker account closure and funds forfeiture as per our Terms and Conditions.

Regarding your query on *PokerEdge.exe*, the same falls in the above categories and usage of *PokerEdge.exe* will result in poker account closure and funds forfeiture as per our Terms and Conditions.

[/ QUOTE ]

[Lestat]

<font color="red"> 1. They really, really help a lot. That's why everyone is so passionate about this subject. </font>

This is my area of disagreement. I agree they help multi-tablers. However, I don't see how they give that much of an edge to a good player playing just 1 table.

The edge of a good player who is playing just 1 table is not going to change much. This is because it is an easy matter to keep track of 9 other players on his own. So all the fish campaigning against these tools will STILL lose their money! In fact, I submit they will lose it MORE quickly, since the pro is able to key in more on the game they are playing in (if he can't mutli-table any more).

I understand some people find comfort by just having the numbers which appear in a HUD. However good players (the pros), use this data mainly so they can multi-table. The fact is, they are LOSING edge by multi-tabling. This is GOOD for the poorer players who happen to be in one of the good player's games.

So when you say that you don't understand how logical thinking people who are good poker players can say these tools don't increase edge, hopefully I've just explained it. They do not INCREASE edge! Well ok, they do. But more so, what they are doing is preventing the loss of edge.

[Nigel]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What's the objection to this type of software? I don't get it.

I could care less if people know how often I raise or what my aggression factor is, I just worry about playing the best I can.

I really don't understand the fear.

Nigel

[/ QUOTE ]

The objection is very simple. Commercial datamining operations provide hard core poker players access to data that helps to strip the casual player of his money in the quickest manner possible. I do not think this is good for the online poker industry or the majority of customers the online poker industry hopes to attract. The hard core folks are there to play and will stay there. There is no reason to give them any tools that help them take money from the other customers any quicker than they normally would.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, Poker Tracker does little to help me strip the casual player of his money. That task is usually accomplished by the casual players mistakes as opposed to me doing anything special based on information I have on them.

The only area that it is slightly helpful is against other 'pros'.

Nigel

[illogical]

[ QUOTE ]
LOOKS LIKE THEY ARE PROHIBITING EVERYTHING

Dear xxxxx,

PartyPoker strictly prohibits usage of programs that:

1) Automate playing of the hand in any way
2) Participate in collusion or any other cheating methods
3) Use any information which may provide you with an unfair advantage through
cheating

We detect and block programs that fall in any of the above categories. Usage of
such programs may result in poker account closure and funds forfeiture as per
our Terms and Conditions.

Regarding your query on *pokertracker, playerview and poker-edge*, as they fall
in the above categories, usage of the same will result in poker account closure
and funds forfeiture as per our Terms and Conditions.

Regards,

Chaitanya
Investigations Team,
alerts@EmpirePoker.com

[/ QUOTE ]

That's very bad news for multi-tabling rocks. [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] Good news is less rock gardens at party [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Overall +EV [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[slavic]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I got the same email. I requested clarification. They said that 'holdem inspector' (a glorified odds calculator) was the culprit and that it is now not allowed.

[/ QUOTE ]
Does this mean that people who use PokerOffice are getting the same email? Anyone gotten it for using that? It does odds calculations too.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm guessing, but I would expect that several of these programs are popping up in front of party for the first time and they are not certain about how to handle them. Are they cheating, are they a service to the game, are they detriment(sp?) to the game. It is very likely that the general discussions of: ban them all, no only these have to go, nope nothing wrong here, have all been explored and as is normal in larger support organizations each of the CS people has heard a different spin on the same story. Thus part support is likely giving us all sorts of responses with just enough data transposition to confuss the heck out of the issue. Add to the fact that this thread is a voluntary response survey were people like to embelish and you can see that whatever is said here is worth just about as much as your paying for it.

This is were party could do with a nice press release, or how about an ombudsman.

[revots33]

[ QUOTE ]
You're drawing arbitrary distinctions on what information players should have. Stats, books, starting hand charts, notes, what not. Every piece adds to your poker ability.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry, but you can't compare reading a poker strategy book, to having software installed on your computer that gives you information about the specific players seated at your table.

It's one thing to take your own notes on people you've played. It's totally another to have a computer program datamine thousands of hands and give you information on players, even those you've never seen before. This is information you didn't work to compile, and it's unfair to the person who doesn't have this software on their computer.

I suppose you could reply, "Well then everyone should go buy the software, then we'd all be on the same playing field." My feeling is that it's much easier and more sensible to say, "NO ONE should use this software. THEN we'd all be on the same playing field."

[Losing all]

Does Mike O'Malley still work for Party? I don't think I've ever seen him make an "official" post, this would be a good thread for one.