So I just lost 30K......

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I agree with this. I think I will indeed stay at 400 for a bit until I get my BR and confidence back up.


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I hope you stick to that. If you do, you'll thank me for it later. It's not an issue of confidence. You were playing 2000NL, you obviously have confidence. It's about having the bankroll to handle the swings and I think everyone will tell you to build your bankroll through playing, not taking from money intended for other things to add to the BR. You'll get into a bad habit and it'll begin to affect your life in very bad ways.

[Python49]

Pretty lame how he's making a post asking about variance and losing streaks and being forced to defend his play.

[James282]

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Pretty lame how he's making a post asking about variance and losing streaks and being forced to defend his play.

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Yeah, we should blissfully let him go on stacking himself over and over in a game he can't beat. Maybe he can beat it, but it sure didn't seem like that originally. People are trying to help him, not criticize him.
-James

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People are trying to help him, not criticize him.


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[MicroBob]

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Pretty lame how he's making a post asking about variance and losing streaks and being forced to defend his play.

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It's pretty common for a losing player to blame his losses on variance and bad-luck.

Just taking him for his word that he 'knows what he's doing' just because he says so is a mistake.
Far more losing streaks are due to inferior play than many players are willing to admit.

Many players are heard to say that they are 'really good' at poker but they just went through the most awful losing streak and string of bad-beats imaginable.
Many of these players would be wise to admit that they were playing above their bankroll and that they probably aren't as good at poker as they thought they were.
They make plays that they think are obvious or 'automatic' when they are not even close to 'automatic' and are sometimes plain wrong.

It's just self-denial.


Jonny admits that his play is flawed at times...but also just points to various bad-beats as the reason why he's losing so much. And I think that pointing to all of one's bad-beats instead of taking a long, hard look at one's own play is the unhealthy way to go.


as far as the 'variance' part of his questions go. I think he's received several responses that dropping 15 buy-in's isn't as impossible or uncommon as he might have thought...and that if he wasn't prepared for the possibility of a $30k drop he shouldn't have been playing that high to begin with.


In short: It's hard to have much patience for the wide variety of players who say, "I'm a good player. I really really am. But I'm super-duper unlucky. But I know that I know what I'm doing."
It comes up over and over and over again.


Personally, I'm on a down-swing myself right now.
And I just seem to be the opposite of the typical mind-set. My immediate reaction to even a mild downswing is, "I'm pretty damned lousy at poker. I really could have saved a bet if I played that hand better" etc etc.

sorry if this was discussed in this post before, but did you lose most or all of the 30k at 1 table? because that could be your other problem.. table selection. Once people see you losing, it becomes a vicious cycle, they want to suck u out. Theres a couple of excellent articles out there about table selection and about table image and momentum.

[Jonny]

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sorry if this was discussed in this post before, but did you lose most or all of the 30k at 1 table?

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If only I had that kind of endurance, 10 thousand hands in a row! To be serious though, it came over the period of a week. I'm not so sure they were tyring to suckout.

[Jonny]

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Just taking him for his word that he 'knows what he's doing' just because he says so is a mistake.
Far more losing streaks are due to inferior play than many players are willing to admit.

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I agree with this. My losing streak was not purely bad luck, nor purely bad play, but a vicious combination of the two.

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Jonny admits that his play is flawed at times...but also just points to various bad-beats as the reason why he's losing so much. And I think that pointing to all of one's bad-beats instead of taking a long, hard look at one's own play is the unhealthy way to go.

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I review my big losing hands after every session and see how I could have played them better. Usually I learn from them and won't make the same mistake again... This is a good tactic to use and I would encourage anyone trying to better their game to do so.
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In short: It's hard to have much patience for the wide variety of players who say, "I'm a good player. I really really am. But I'm super-duper unlucky. But I know that I know what I'm doing."
It comes up over and over and over again.

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Yeah I pretty much hate those people too. I always tell my roomate after one of us is running hot/cold: "We all have the same luck in the long run, so stop complaining" etc..

I think its fair to say I know what I'm doing. I have studied the game and been critical of my own play. How many players turn $50 into $100K in a 150K hand, 1.5 year period? Answer: none who are not HIGHLY critical of their own play.

I agree with you Bob. I've had plenty of swings as a result of bad luck, but the most severe swings I could never blame on luck alone. There's always something I did wrong, whether it be playing too loose, being too damn stubborn, playing tired or in a bad mood, being too proud to drop levels, etc.

[jt_patriot]

Russian Bear, hell yeah BG. Second off, this topic has run it's course, I learned alot just from reading some of the better posts. In short, Jonny is a good player who had not run into a situation like this before but will learn from it and become a better player because of it. Tuck Foledo this Tuesday.