Curtains Hand #1 (1C5)- Bubble play

[AA suited]

why is this called a Curtains hand if IC5 is posting it? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[Matt R.]

I always forget to use it myself. But I really don't see the point in *not* using it in this instance. You're getting called preflop if you push. You might NOT get called if you simply call preflop and then push the flop. I really don't see any advantage here by pushing preflop... unless the guy is not good and will fold getting ridiculous pot odds. A9o is too good to fold to a button min-raise given the stack sizes, but you really don't want to get called with A9o. I have to think the stop 'n go gives you more fold equity than a pre-flop push. Even if the increase in FE is only a small amount, a small amount is plenty to make it the better play.

[sofere]

IMO A9 is too strong to fold in this situation. Your ahead of villains range and the next lowest stack is at 2618. If you don't make your stand here you'll have no fold equity in the future.

I don't like stop and go with any two here cause it really doesn't add all that much fold equity.

[Dr_Jeckyl_00]

Hero should fold, IMO. I only play $11-$33, but when someone enters pot, especially with a raise, they rarely lay the hand down, and A9 is not strong enough to play here. Let's see what everyone else thinks...

[ilya]

Hero must play here IMO. He is by far the shortest stack and is on the verge of running out of FE. Also, if he folds here there is no guarantee that he will have an opportunity to open-push in the next couple of hands, as the other stacks may well keep raising each other to take advantage of the fact that Hero is short.
I prefer pushing preflop to a stop-and-go, because the only hands Button is likely to fold to a stop-and-go for just 600 more on the flop are hands that Hero is 60/40 or better against.

[curtains]

[ QUOTE ]
Hero must play here IMO. He is by far the shortest stack and is on the verge of running out of FE. Also, if he folds here there is no guarantee that he will have an opportunity to open-push in the next couple of hands, as the other stacks may well keep raising each other to take advantage of the fact that Hero is short.
I prefer pushing preflop to a stop-and-go, because the only hands Button is likely to fold to a stop-and-go for just 600 more on the flop are hands that Hero is 60/40 or better against.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dude if my opponent folds a hand that has a 40 percent chance to beat me on the flop, this is a major accomplishment for me, and I mean MAJOR, in a game where elimiantion is such a disaster.

In any case I did stop+go, missed the flop completely, and was successful, as my opponent folded. Probably the difference between the two plays is pretty slim, but I feel that stop+going was correct in this case, as I feel they would have almost surely called preflop with such a stack for only about 600 more.

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hero must play here IMO. He is by far the shortest stack and is on the verge of running out of FE. Also, if he folds here there is no guarantee that he will have an opportunity to open-push in the next couple of hands, as the other stacks may well keep raising each other to take advantage of the fact that Hero is short.
I prefer pushing preflop to a stop-and-go, because the only hands Button is likely to fold to a stop-and-go for just 600 more on the flop are hands that Hero is 60/40 or better against.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dude if my opponent folds a hand that has a 40 percent chance to beat me on the flop, this is a major accomplishment for me, and I mean MAJOR, in a game where elimiantion is such a disaster.

[/ QUOTE ]

I meant that Villain would only fold hands on the flop that would be 40% or less against you if you pushed preflop & he called.

edit: never mind, I think I misread your post.

[Scuba Chuck]

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more importantly is, why didn't SB come over the top?

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The strategy of just coming over the top of anyone who has less chips than you on the bubble, is very overrated. I wouldn't raise without a good hand as the SB...the risk is too high in a world where people may call with something like 55.

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Well, couldn't you argue that your hand has far too much value to do a stop n go here? Specifically, don't you want him to call with a hand like 55 or KQ? You need to double up here.

[curtains]

Of course I don't want him to call with a hand like 55 or KQ!!!! What crazy universe of sit and go playing have I entered? You want to be called by a hand that is either 40%-55% against you when there are already 700 chips in the pot, just to win an extra 600?

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
Of course I don't want him to call with a hand like 55 or KQ!!!! What crazy universe of sit and go playing have I entered? You want to be called by a hand that is either 40%-55% against you when there are already 700 chips in the pot, just to win an extra 600?

[/ QUOTE ]

Obviously you don't want to get called by 55. It's a disaster. Getting called by KQo preflop would be a lesser disaster at the worst as it is +$EV to call there preflop if he shows you KQo, but stop-and-go may give a higher $EV. I don't think he's folding KQ on the flop though, at least not unless you would have had him beat.
But I think you're right that a stop-and-go is better, as it gives pretty much the same $EV against hands like KQ and 55, but increases your $EV a bunch against hands like K8s.