Need help on my play...couple of hands and general advice

aloiz · #1 04-08-2004, 09:14 PM

I've been playing poker for a little over a year now, but just started playing limit two months ago. I don't consider myself a passive NL player, but looking back at my limit play I know I'm missing tons of bets, and many times it's just because I'm playing too fast, or I've just taken a bad beat at which point I usually become almost timid, always thinking about whether I’m beat. Another thing I've been noticing is that when I'm not in a hand I'm usually pretty good about putting players on a hand or two, but sometimes when I get involved in a pot my reads during the hand are way off. After going back to the HH and studying the hand I'm usually able to make sense of it all. Could it just be that I'm playing too fast? Most of the time I've made up my mind whether to raise, call, or fold by the time the action gets to me, and I will usually only slow down if I’ve a difficult call or am involved in a really big pot. Any advice?

Here’s a couple of pretty typical hands. Any and all comments appreciated.

Hand 1: Just sat down, no real reads on any players.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
Hero calls, UTG+1 raises, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 3-bets, CO folds, Button folds, SB calls, BB calls, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls, MP2 calls.

99 UTG should that be raise or fold?

Flop: (18 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, BB folds, Hero checks, UTG+1 bets, MP2 calls, MP3 folds, SB calls, Hero folds.

Turn: (10.50 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, UTG+1 bets, MP2 calls, SB calls.

River: (13.50 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, UTG+1 bets, MP2 calls, SB calls.

Final Pot: 16.50 BB
Main Pot: 16.50 BB, between UTG+1, MP2 and SB. > Pot won by UTG+1 (16.50 BB).

Results in white below: 
UTG+1 shows Ah As (one pair, aces).
MP2 shows Jc Tc (one pair, jacks).
SB shows Jd Kd (one pair, jacks).
Outcome: UTG+1 wins 16.50 BB. 

Hand 2: Read on BB is that he’s a pretty solid player, and UTG is a little loose.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (7 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, Hero raises, MP2 folds, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (6.66 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets, BB calls, UTG calls.

Turn: (4.83 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB bets, UTG raises, Hero folds, BB 3-bets, UTG calls.

River: (10.83 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets, UTG folds.

Final Pot: 11.83 BB
Main Pot: 10.83 BB, won by BB.
Pot 2: 1 BB, overbet by BB.

Results in white below: 
BB doesn't show.
Outcome: BB wins 11.83 BB. 

Comments on the fold?

Hand 3: Only read is on BB in that he’s pretty loose.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO folds, Hero raises, SB calls, BB calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (8 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, BB bets, MP3 folds, Hero calls, SB calls.

Turn: (5.50 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets, SB calls, BB folds.

River: (7.50 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks.

Final Pot: 7.50 BB
Main Pot: 7.50 BB, between Hero and SB. > Pot won by Hero (7.50 BB).

Results in white below: 
SB shows Ts Tc (two pair, queens and tens).
Hero shows Ah Jc (two pair, queens and jacks).
Outcome: Hero wins 7.50 BB. 

On the river is this a must bet situation? I guess I’ve rarely seen a player who would slowplay the queen that much. Comments?

Hand 4: No real reads on any of the players involved.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 raises, MP3 calls, Hero calls, Button folds, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: (10 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB bets, BB folds, MP2 calls, MP3 raises, Hero 3-bets, SB caps, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (13 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB bets, MP2 calls, MP3 raises, Hero calls, SB calls, MP2 calls.

I think this was an awful call. Should have three-bet.

River: (21 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, MP2 checks, MP3 checks, Hero checks.

Final Pot: 21 BB
Main Pot: 21 BB, between MP2, MP3, Hero and SB. > Pot won by Hero (21 BB).

Results in white below: 
SB shows 7h Kd (two pair, kings and sevens).
MP2 shows Ts Js (one pair, tens).
MP3 shows Qd Kc (two pair, kings and queens).
Hero shows 7s 7c (three of a kind, sevens).
Outcome: Hero wins 21 BB. 

Check on the river OK?

Hand 5: No read on BB.
Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 raises, MP3 folds, Hero calls, Button folds, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, BB bets, MP2 calls, Hero raises, SB folds, BB 3-bets, MP2 folds, Hero calls.

Turn: (7.50 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero calls.

River: (9.50 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 11.50 BB
Main Pot: 11.50 BB, between BB and Hero. > Pot won by BB (11.50 BB).

Results in white below: 
BB shows 7s 7c (full house, sevens full of threes).
Hero shows 8d 8s (two pair, eights and threes).
Outcome: BB wins 11.50 BB. 

Anybody raise here on the turn?

Thanks,
Aloiz

blackaces13 · #2 04-08-2004, 09:43 PM

Here's my take, take it with a grain of salt I don't claim to be a professional.

Hand 1: you played it pretty passively. I may even fold preflop after the UTG call was 3 bet. Then again I don't really know how you handle pockets 9's if its 3 bets back to you and you have a bet already in, basically it sucks to be in that spot. Someone else can tell you how to play that better than I can so I'll move on.

Hand 2 There is absolutely NO WAY I can fold the turn here. UTG can easily be semi bluffing a draw or have something like A9. He also may very well have 2-pair or a made hand that kills you but I'd have to call down to find out. Theres already a lot of money in the pot so you don't even have to win the hand 50% for the call to be profitable. The pot is laying you 4:1 here, add the likely bet on the river and you're at about 5:2 effective odds. So if you can win the hand more than 2 times in 7 you make money.

Hand 3 BET THAT RIVER!!! He looks like he has a 5 and he's praying that you don't bet into him because he knows he's gonna have to call you and watch his money slide your way. You HAVE to make him pay you on the river. If he had a Q or AA/KK than you he'd have let you know about it at some point. He doesn't, punish him.

Hand 4: 3-bet that turn. The flush hasn't hit yet so you HAVE to play your set as best. Set over set is rare so don't live in fear of it even in the face of aggression. The river card SUCKED but it was also checked to you. Most people don't check flushes when everyone's been going nuts in the hand on previous streets, the straight is another story though. Checking the river isn't HORRIBLE but you definitely missed a pretty good value bet there.

Hand 5, you played it right. He got lucky on the turn. I don't think you can raise the turn here anyway, he's been showing too much strength and you don't want to be looking at 3-bets back to you. I go into call down mode here after the flop just like you did. Rough beat.

Like I said, I'm not the resident expert around here so take my advice for what its worth. I did the best I could, you can believe that much anyway.