PLO8 25 - Did I overplay flop?

[Burdzthewurd]

Should I have popped this back up OOP? I'd def. do it with one wheel card at least, I thought it'd be better to see a flop first though

***** Hand History for Game 3183396846 *****
$25 PL Omaha Hi/Lo - Sunday, December 11, 17:43:19 EDT 2005
Table Table 65412 (Real Money)
Seat 8 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: BTW2005 ( $45 )
Seat 2: counterspy5 ( $31.27 )
Seat 9: HJL13 ( $101.80 )
Seat 10: AmourOfGod ( $60.88 )
Seat 5: kio878 ( $24.04 )
Seat 6: VGAAZ ( $34.06 )
Seat 4: hulkhogan ( $22.60 )
Seat 7: Rocket21222 ( $25 )
Seat 3: seymourswift ( $24.75 )
Seat 8: bonds444life ( $19.40 )
AmourOfGod posts small blind [$0.10].
BTW2005 posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to BTW2005 [ Ah Ts As Kc ]
counterspy5 folds.
seymourswift folds.
>You have options at Table 65464 Table!.
hulkhogan folds.
>You have options at Table 65464 Table!.
>You have options at Table 70696 (No DP) Table!.
kio878 folds.
VGAAZ raises [$0.85].
>You have options at Table 65464 Table!.
>You have options at Table 70696 (No DP) Table!.
Rocket21222 folds.
bonds444life folds.
AmourOfGod folds.
BTW2005 calls [$0.60].
** Dealing Flop ** [ 8s, Qc, 5s ]
BTW2005 checks.
VGAAZ bets [$0.25].
>You have options at Table 70696 (No DP) Table!.
BTW2005 raises [$2.50].
VGAAZ raises [$4.50].
BTW2005 raises [$13.50].
VGAAZ calls [$11.25].
** Dealing Turn ** [ Jc ]
BTW2005 is all-In [$28.15]
VGAAZ is all-In [$17.21]
** Dealing River ** [ 5c ]
BTW2005 shows [ Ah, Ts, As, Kc ] two pairs, aces and fives.
VGAAZ shows [ 3d, 8c, 8h, 4s ] a full house, Eights full of fives.
BTW2005 wins $10.94 from side pot #1 with two pairs, aces and fives.
VGAAZ wins $65.22 from the main pot with a full house, Eights full of fives.
There was no qualifying low hand.
counterspy5 has left the table.

Well, I'm not an expert like some of the people on here but I would have re-potted pre flop. That being said I still don't think it would have done you any good. Any body that raises with 3,4,8,8 pre flop then plays middle set against your raises would not get out ever anyhow, not that I don't play midlle sets but it scares me to death. On the other side, your drawing to flush against a low board on the flop with no low. On the turn, your drawing to your flush and a straight with nothing made yet against someone who is not backing off. Did you put him on anything? Even if you check the turn he's probably going to pot it anyhow. Perhaps re-raise preflop, check the low board flop? Hopefully FatBallz,Ribbo, gergery and the others who play this all the time will give a better answer.

[Wolffink]

It's an interesting hand.

People overplay Aces. After reading Berman's admonition in SS2 about how average players lose more with AA** than good players--and this is in Omaha high!--I've slowed down with Aces. I'd still love to get all-in preflop or nearly all-in. If I can't do this, I'll see a relatively cheap flop and if I don't hit it, get away from it. Aces are only a pair and a pair isn't that much in 08. Even if you hit trips, it's still dangerous since trips get beaten by straights and flushes so much and your opponent might be splitting low and on a freeroll (not so much on this particular flop, but generally).

You're also out of position which means you may win a small pot or lose a big one.

There's two to a low on the flop, but you have the nut flush draw.

I'd bet out on the flop to see where I was at. Then I'd play it slow. It's similar to a Morton's Fork situation. If you're ahead, you win more by playing slow. If you're behind you lose less by playing slow. I only have a pair of aces and a draw--I don't want to risk my stack here if I get played with.

There is another hand coming up. Don't fall in love with Aces. Try to win it on the flop and if you don't, shut down and try to see the hand thru cheaply.

The all-in on the river bet isnt this one of those situations where you're only getting called by hands that beat you? Aren't you better off checking and at least giving the opponent a chance to bluff before you commit your chips??

[Burdzthewurd]

He was making a ton of weak raises, I put him basically on a strong A2 with maybe a wheel card to go along, maybe a Queen. Certainly would not put him on a set there, unless he had a lock hand like A255, AA55, A355, etc. I didn't think a potraise OOP with just high cards would be that smart, and I thought that flop was only good for a low hand with only a 67 as a logical straight draw. Looking back I feel I should have waited to fire it in on the turn with a brick high card coming, but I was going all the way with it and figured I might be able to scoop the pot if I can push his low out. Thought the river would be a good card for me, too. I've had some problems playing AA with paints in the blinds, any posts discussing that?

[Wolffink]

If you put him on a weak hand, then it's more of a reason to check/call him down. If he's overplaying the nut low draw--then well, sh*t, you're overplaying your high cards too and not at that much of an advantage. Wait and go to war on another hand.

It seems I'm usually advocating waiting until the turn to pull the trigger on this forum. Since it's easy to get called in this game, it makes more sense to see another card and if it comes good to you, put your money in there.

If someone is overplaying wait until you have the nuts and then bust him. It may take 50 or 100 hands before you get his stack but think of it as inevitable. Steal a few pots from here to there if you can, usually when you have position or it is head-to-head or three-player.

I try to think of playing AAxx hands too strong as a weakness that I don't have but many other players have. I make my money in 08 having the nuts or near nuts or a two-way hand heads-up that isn't likely to be beaten both ways. Etc. I lose my biggest pots when I run into monsters from other players. There's a lesson here for me. The nuts are often out there. It may be improbable but if your opponent is calling and raising in 08, he very well might have the nuts.

I will bet and pick up pots here and there, usually with position or as a semi-bluff.

Your hand must fit the flop. You have to clinically analyze your AAxx hand just like you would any other hand. If you have AAKKds and the flop comes all low and not in your suit and face aggro , you should fold. Alas. I analyze and I have the discipline to lay any hand down postflop that doesn't fit the flop and give me decent odds to scoop. A powerful winning force surrounds me.... lol